Mike1alike
Established member
Very peculiar problem, indeed.
Are you going to try another alternator?
Are you going to try another alternator?
Technical Battery warning light and no power steering
- Thread starter Arvid
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Technical Battery warning light and no power steering
It's very tempting. But I'm going to do some more checks as per advice from koalar first. If I buy a new Denso I have to make sure it's a new unit and not rebuilt. Have seen them still for sale at aprox. £200 online. Last owner paid £500 for the Hella and if he wanted a Bosch they were £750. Almost unbelievable and madness prices - at least here...
Here is another unhappy Hella user in Germany. Common nominator for both this Alfa and the other Fiat is that it would help to switch off ignition and start again. Battery warning light would then be off.
"Hello, drive an Alfa 159 1.9 jtd 16V from 2007.Last week my alternator said goodbye,which is not an unknown problem. I ordered a new one from Hella, because the trust in AR is not very great. In the course of this, I got a new battery, because the old one was no longer the best. Everything replaced now there is the problem that the battery symbol in the display is still lit. Have checked the voltage of the alternator with running engine. Are 14,20V on. Even under load, nothing changes. I find it strange that when I turn off the Alfa and start it again immediately, the battery symbol does not appear. Only when some time passes in between, it appears again in the display.Error memory was deleted after the change of the Lima because there had been a lot deposited by the Lima damage.Despite battery symbol nothing is stored in the error memory. The mechanic (independent workshop) said that the instrument cluster also has a fault memory, where he has no access to it.
Maybe you can help me. I find it all very strange. Oh yes, car behaves otherwise completely normal"
Might not be comparable to my car but it makes me wonder...
"Hello, drive an Alfa 159 1.9 jtd 16V from 2007.Last week my alternator said goodbye,which is not an unknown problem. I ordered a new one from Hella, because the trust in AR is not very great. In the course of this, I got a new battery, because the old one was no longer the best. Everything replaced now there is the problem that the battery symbol in the display is still lit. Have checked the voltage of the alternator with running engine. Are 14,20V on. Even under load, nothing changes. I find it strange that when I turn off the Alfa and start it again immediately, the battery symbol does not appear. Only when some time passes in between, it appears again in the display.Error memory was deleted after the change of the Lima because there had been a lot deposited by the Lima damage.Despite battery symbol nothing is stored in the error memory. The mechanic (independent workshop) said that the instrument cluster also has a fault memory, where he has no access to it.
Maybe you can help me. I find it all very strange. Oh yes, car behaves otherwise completely normal"
Might not be comparable to my car but it makes me wonder...
Thinking about it there is a preliminary check you can do on the grey and black wire going to the alternator D+ without climbing under the car
If you try and measure it’s voltage it will read 0V regardless of any break
If you separate the D04 connector
And connect one end of a test light to battery positive and the other end to the grey and black cable going to the D+ The bulb will only light if there’s continuity all the way to the chassis. Which would be the best way
You could also disconnect the battery (may or may not be needed)
and measure the ohms between the chassis and the grey and black wire at D04 not sure what it should read but will be very low
If you try and measure it’s voltage it will read 0V regardless of any break
If you separate the D04 connector
And connect one end of a test light to battery positive and the other end to the grey and black cable going to the D+ The bulb will only light if there’s continuity all the way to the chassis. Which would be the best way
You could also disconnect the battery (may or may not be needed)
and measure the ohms between the chassis and the grey and black wire at D04 not sure what it should read but will be very low
Clever thinking 
This test I can manage in the garden.
As I mentioned early in this thread we did measure D+ from alternator terminal and to pin 25. With engine running we had 13.8v at the three point we measured - Terminal D+ alternator,D004 and pin 25. What we didn't do was to measure continuity - didn't think it was needed as we had correct voltage.
This test I can manage in the garden.As I mentioned early in this thread we did measure D+ from alternator terminal and to pin 25. With engine running we had 13.8v at the three point we measured - Terminal D+ alternator,D004 and pin 25. What we didn't do was to measure continuity - didn't think it was needed as we had correct voltage.
I think this is D04 connector . It is the only one inside the fuse box under the fuse panel.
On Gray/Black wire ( thin cable ) there are these voltage values:
1.27 volts ignition ON engine OFF
14.25 volts engine running at 830 rot/min.
May be the regulator from your Hella alternator is different version and this is the cause you got 9.8 volts.
1.27 volts ignition ON engine OFF
14.25 volts engine running at 830 rot/min.
May be the regulator from your Hella alternator is different version and this is the cause you got 9.8 volts.
Wish I had those measurments You are right,it could be an alternator problem but that is not yet established. Haven't had time to do the measurments I need to. Hopefully later this week. My son brought home his first car yesterday so now it will be a tug of war between the Bravo and his E34.
You are right,it could be an alternator problem but that is not yet established. Haven't had time to do the measurments I need to. Hopefully later this week. My son brought home his first car yesterday so now it will be a tug of war between the Bravo and his E34.
Mine and @aschiuta are roughly the same
Because there’s two connectors B+ and D+
Measuring three point does not necessarily mean D+ and the body computer are connected
B+ could be back feeding the body computer end
D+ feeding the other
But until we get a low voltage at the body computer at less than 700rpm we aren’t going to get very far
Because there’s two connectors B+ and D+
Measuring three point does not necessarily mean D+ and the body computer are connected
B+ could be back feeding the body computer end
D+ feeding the other
But until we get a low voltage at the body computer at less than 700rpm we aren’t going to get very far
Hopefully get to it tomorrow
Well,did some measurements and it does indeed disclose some facts. With D004 disconnected I measured resistance to alternator chassis - and it was actually 410kohm. I’m tempted to say the lead is not connected at all but I am actually getting 13.8v through it with engine running. Anyway it’s a good find and must be resolved.
So,what do I do next ? Run a new lead ? First I need to get under the car and check the cable connector in D+ and check the state of it
So,what do I do next ? Run a new lead ? First I need to get under the car and check the cable connector in D+ and check the state of it
Come to think of it… D+ connector might need to be disconnected on alternator - or else last measurment is invalid. I may be measuring against the diodes.
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Reconnect the two sides of D04 and measure the resistence between D+ and pin 25 of BCM.
This is the only right measurement and you obtain few ohms if the wire is ok.
Personal I think the wire is good and the Hella regulator is different from original alternator regulator.
If you post the car VIN I can tell you the partnumber of original alternator.
And you can look for a second hand one with same partnumber.
I need to get the car on a postlift first but I agree,I need to do that measurment. Correct alternator would be Fiat 46809068 and Denso MS1012101870 or DAN502 as Denso calls todays version.
I would have expected it to be lower. I believe the last one i measured was 1.5k with the D+ Disconnect. Yes I know it’s no a bravo so not strictly apples to apples
Key on engine not running must be Very low volts before the engine is started. Otherwise the body computer will know there’s a problem and not charge properly and shut the EPS off
No, find any problem and repair it
New cables without knowing where or what the problem is can work or end in magic smoke
First I need to get under the car and check the cable connector in D+ and check the state of it
Last one I checked was 1.5k D+ post to alternator case no wires connected
Ok,so at least you also got Kohms. I expected it to be lower though. Are you using a Denso on the Stilo ? I will pull out the large car jack and crawl under for the D+. I need to see what's going on under there.
Ok,disconnected D+ from alternator and measuring from there to pin 25 gives 0.3 Ohm. That should mean cable from inside to outside is good. Checked voltage once again and it's still 9.8v ignition on/engine off and same voltage with D+ alternator connected or disconnected. Do I need a new alternator ?
Not the same as my Panda which has a similar circuit
Not the same as @aschiuta car
Not the same as the last alternator I fitted
As far as I can tell yes the alternator D+ terminal isn’t sending out the correct voltage
Mike1alike
Established member
If you get a new alternator, I wish you that it will fix the problem!
Would be cosy if you could borrow a good alternator from a similar car, to test if that really fixes it.
Would be cosy if you could borrow a good alternator from a similar car, to test if that really fixes it.
