Technical Sluggish Panda 1.2 Euro 5
- Thread starter Martijn169
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Technical Sluggish Panda 1.2 Euro 5
Martijn169
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How probable is clogging of the cat and muffler? Especially if no other symptoms seem to be apparent?
And coming to think of it: how about valve clearances? Are they prone to deviate over time and mileage?
What other symptoms of exhaust system obstruction are you referring too?
Rev limit changes with ECU versions
6000 - 6500 some are 500 less for the engines first few thousand miles
If you can only rev to 5000 on a warm engine something is wrong
Start the engine, get someone to raise the revs slight and unplug the MAP, if you take it for a spin is the an improvement when it's running in open loop
Combined sensor, it's also the inlet ambient temperature, wrong reading give wrong lookup, give wrong fueling, give hesitation on acceleration
not by much; shimmed OHC engines generally are fine for at least the first 75k miles. My own Panda is now on around 125k and there's no reason to suspect the valve gear needs reshimming.
Martijn169
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Ok thanks.
Martijn169
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I would expect particular sounds or non-lineair acceleration in the lower rev range. Or anything else that stands out.
To me that is what is so strange about this situation. The only thing noticable is the lack of power in the higher rev range. Besides that everything is fine: easy starting, stable idle, good fuel economy, ...
Tomorrow I will pull a plug. Hopefully that will tell us more.
If cat/Exhaust system partially obstructed, engine will operate normally up to the point at which the exhaust gas volume exceeds the flow capacity of the exhaust system . In turn preventing the engine drawing in air correctly. Very similar to obstructed air inlet or driving without fully pressing accelerator pedal
Looking at spark plug will not give info on possibility of exhaust blockage
What's the result
Martijn169
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I'will check tomorrow.
If I understand correctly I need to rev the engine slightly when unplugging the MAP and then take it for a spin and check acceleration?
Martijn169
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What would be a good way of checking blockage of exhaust? I would say that if the exhaust is blocked the cat is the no.1 suspect?
I have read that a possible cat blockage can be checked by measuring the temp of the cat with an infrared thermometer.
Can anyone confirm? And what number am I looking for (in relation to the temperature of the other exhaust components)?
The car operated two different modes
Open and closed loop
You would have to unplug the sensor first to force the ECU not to use the feedback from the sensor, take it for a spin
Then remove the O2 or unbolt the exhaust manifold a bit to allow it to breath, take it for a spin and compare the results
Yes
Should just be able to just unplug and start the engine, but some cars can be very difficult to start when disconnect
Others stall as you unplug but others don't
I had three Panda's , they all behaved slightly differently, once it's be running a bit with it disconnect it should settle down
Martijn169
New member
Ok. Time to share some more info.
The car has done approx. 200 km since the last service. Yesterday my wife took the car to work and this morning I pulled out the MAP sensor and the spark plug from cylinder 1. So what you see is the result of approx. 200 km normal driving.
The MAP sensor
Spark plug cylinder no.1
After cleaning the MAP sensor I did some experiments with the MAP sensor as suggested by koalar.
To my big surprise tampering with the MAP sensor did not make a significantly difference regarding the sluggishness. It is fair to suspect the MAP sensor to be the culprit? Considering the relatively low cost of this component I am inclined to replace it anyway to rule definitely rule it out.
The finding from my experiment.
The car has done approx. 200 km since the last service. Yesterday my wife took the car to work and this morning I pulled out the MAP sensor and the spark plug from cylinder 1. So what you see is the result of approx. 200 km normal driving.
The MAP sensor
Spark plug cylinder no.1
After cleaning the MAP sensor I did some experiments with the MAP sensor as suggested by koalar.
To my big surprise tampering with the MAP sensor did not make a significantly difference regarding the sluggishness. It is fair to suspect the MAP sensor to be the culprit? Considering the relatively low cost of this component I am inclined to replace it anyway to rule definitely rule it out.
The finding from my experiment.
