General Ducato 3.0 multijet 160 comformatic fix selespeed magnetti

[Seanwinder22]

Just an update to the situation after a few days driving and using multiecuscan
All parameters adjusted themselves
Here’s what I had to carry out which after changing fluids and bleeding and change of potentiometers sensors and removing harness needs
Delete statistical data
Clutch replacement
Electro pump replacement
Actuator base adjustment
Clutch drain
Then last Production/Service final calibration which does a good few mini resets also involved in this is clutch calibration anyway

If you find the clutch rpm is not 0 and above this carry on bleeding the system and do clutch replacement routine again and once at 0 rpm you are good to go

But first

1. move from neutral to reverse wait 2 seconds and then back to neutral - repeat 10 times
2. move from neutral to drive wait 2 seconds and then back to neutral - repeat 10 times
3. Go for a drive going through all gears in manual mode then drive auto mode

Just remember to take a image of parameters before doing any reset or adjustments then check again after the routines
Most important ones are gear positions and

Clutch engaged position (self-adjusted)

	Gear/engage position
	Selection position
	Clutch pressure plate travel
	Clutch pressure plate reference

 

[deejays]

Ok so been for a drive letting the gearbox relearn etc drive brilliantly didn’t feel any issues at all very smooth
BUT….. when home parked up checking data in parameters my heart sunk because now I can see a new clutch kit will definitely be needed
What I think the issue is here is the slave
Can anyone see from this screenshot while sat in neutral engine started what issues I’m seeing that should be on 0
It’s intermittent it’s not all that time
I tried replicating it but only did it twice

Hi @Seanwinder22 I have some good news for you. First, I have just caught up with the past week of your post – having been away – I have been following your post with much interest as it has been very informative. Now, the good news. I am referring to your “heart-sinking” moment when the clutch rpm was not zero with engine running and vehicle stationary. I do not believe it has anything to do with air in the clutch line, or a failing clutch slave or clutch. The reason I say this is from the information contained in the photo you presented of the MES live data screen. If you take a second look at it, you will observe that the normal recorded Solenoid valve current at zero flow is 982.8mA. Further down the list from that, second from the bottom you can see that the actual live Clutch solenoid valve current is 0.0mA which means the clutch solenoid valve is not operated, hence the clutch master cylinder piston has no hydraulic pressure applied and correspondingly the slave and the clutch will not be operated, and the clutch disc speed will be that of the engine. So, that is the good news. The bad news is that it is likely an intermittent contact in the wiring to the clutch solenoid – which coincides with why you started this post off in the beginning. Having said “bad news” I reckon you like me would be happy with this outcome as it sure beats replacing the clutch slave. So, perhaps a second look at the clutch solenoid connections to prevent this intermittent issue catching you out on the open road. Cheers, Daryl

 

[Seanwinder22]

Hi @Seanwinder22 I have some good news for you. First, I have just caught up with the past week of your post – having been away – I have been following your post with much interest as it has been very informative. Now, the good news. I am referring to your “heart-sinking” moment when the clutch rpm was not zero with engine running and vehicle stationary. I do not believe it has anything to do with air in the clutch line, or a failing clutch slave or clutch. The reason I say this is from the information contained in the photo you presented of the MES live data screen. If you take a second look at it, you will observe that the normal recorded Solenoid valve current at zero flow is 982.8mA. Further down the list from that, second from the bottom you can see that the actual live Clutch solenoid valve current is 0.0mA which means the clutch solenoid valve is not operated, hence the clutch master cylinder piston has no hydraulic pressure applied and correspondingly the slave and the clutch will not be operated, and the clutch disc speed will be that of the engine. So, that is the good news. The bad news is that it is likely an intermittent contact in the wiring to the clutch solenoid – which coincides with why you started this post off in the beginning. Having said “bad news” I reckon you like me would be happy with this outcome as it sure beats replacing the clutch slave. So, perhaps a second look at the clutch solenoid connections to prevent this intermittent issue catching you out on the open road. Cheers, Daryl

View attachment 457867

Hi mate thanks for the great information which does mate sense
But since I changed the clutch position sensor and did the Production/Service final calibration and bled clutch more everything works has normal
I have just carried out in the actuator tests for all solenoid and watched live sat for sensors when selecting gears etc and everything works perfectly

I will definitely keep checking and a close eye on this However and yes ANYTHING is better then paying £1500 someone said to me yesterday why are you changing parts that ain’t broke still?

This is my answer…. I own a 59 plate fiat ducato 3.0 multijet 160 motorhome currently on 80k miles I can not find any information on if this has ever had a clutch but I very much doubt it
So the selespeed will also have all original parts like accumulator etc which this part is well known to go at 10 years old even lower so while giving the selespeed a service change parts which will save time and more money in the long run seals filters always keep on top of

So thanks for the advice I will still look deeper in to this in multiecuscan data because has you say it may be a wire shorting issue
Which I have had plenty

 

[Seanwinder22]

Come to think of it the problem I had on Evo1 contact when it was cracked and shorting out
This evo is the solenoid valve
We have Evo0 to Evo3 and from memory I’m sure it’s Evo 0 and Evo1 at the side of each other
Then below those are Evo 2 and Evo 3 so the first 2 I had issue with and all I did was pull the broke pin and buy a new one and fitted this so I will look at the solenoid this time

 

[deejays]

Hi mate thanks for the great information which does mate sense
But since I changed the clutch position sensor and did the Production/Service final calibration and bled clutch more everything works has normal
I have just carried out in the actuator tests for all solenoid and watched live sat for sensors when selecting gears etc and everything works perfectly

I will definitely keep checking and a close eye on this However and yes ANYTHING is better then paying £1500 someone said to me yesterday why are you changing parts that ain’t broke still?

This is my answer…. I own a 59 plate fiat ducato 3.0 multijet 160 motorhome currently on 80k miles I can not find any information on if this has ever had a clutch but I very much doubt it
So the selespeed will also have all original parts like accumulator etc which this part is well known to go at 10 years old even lower so while giving the selespeed a service change parts which will save time and more money in the long run seals filters always keep on top of

So thanks for the advice I will still look deeper in to this in multiecuscan data because has you say it may be a wire shorting issue
Which I have had plenty

Glad to help. As you said it was intermittent and you only saw it twice - very lucky you captured the live data with MES. It is likely one of the poles of the connector to the clutch solenoid going open circuit, rather than a short I would think - considering the damage was originally caused by water corrosion. At least you are aware and if it does fail you will know exactly where to look. Cheers.

 

[Seanwinder22]

Glad to help. As you said it was intermittent and you only saw it twice - very lucky you captured the live data with MES. It is likely one of the poles of the connector to the clutch solenoid going open circuit, rather than a short I would think - considering the damage was originally caused by water corrosion. At least you are aware and if it does fail you will know exactly where to look. Cheers.

brill mate I’m happy either way which all now makes sense
It all started with the harness contact on Evo 1
Now it’s giving readings on evo0 for clutch

 

[deejays]

brill mate I’m happy either way which all now makes sense
It all started with the harness contact on Evo 1
Now it’s giving readings on evo0 for clutch

This may be of assistance if you are ever trying to sort what connect to what: (May not be correct for all models of course).

 

[Seanwinder22]

Looking back over my notes from 2022 it all started when trying to select first gear to drive which came down to
Proportional pressure solenoid for odd gear engagement (1 - 3 - 5). Which is Evo 1 which my contact was broken

Now I see issue with clutch solenoid which is Evo 0 so I will check the solenoid

This I do remember however because on my harness the tags was worn out
We should have white tags labelled Evo 1 and clutch sensor and so on …. Mine was all rubbed out on the Evo and I remember when fitting I hope I get these the right way around

But here’s what I’m thinking now if I did get Evo 0 and Evo 1 in the wrong plug vice versa then maybe this contact I changed was not a good fix but because it’s now not in its original seat for Evo1 I’m not having issues for first gear selection now but clutch selection it’s shorting out

Do today I will swap these Evo 0 &1 over and check
Maybe I need to just buy new harness ?
But like you say at least I’m on the money for a permanent fix now

 

[MSjoberg]

This may be of assistance if you are ever trying to sort what connect to what: (May not be correct for all models of course).View attachment 457898

It says Comfort-Matic at the bottom but it shows 5 solenoid valves i.e. one more than we have. Perhaps it is for Dualogic as the text on the processor says? I'm sure there are similarities but it would be even better if there was a similar drawing available for the 4-solenoid Comfortmatic version somewhere?

 

[Seanwinder22]

Hi @Seanwinder22 I have some good news for you. First, I have just caught up with the past week of your post – having been away – I have been following your post with much interest as it has been very informative. Now, the good news. I am referring to your “heart-sinking” moment when the clutch rpm was not zero with engine running and vehicle stationary. I do not believe it has anything to do with air in the clutch line, or a failing clutch slave or clutch. The reason I say this is from the information contained in the photo you presented of the MES live data screen. If you take a second look at it, you will observe that the normal recorded Solenoid valve current at zero flow is 982.8mA. Further down the list from that, second from the bottom you can see that the actual live Clutch solenoid valve current is 0.0mA which means the clutch solenoid valve is not operated, hence the clutch master cylinder piston has no hydraulic pressure applied and correspondingly the slave and the clutch will not be operated, and the clutch disc speed will be that of the engine. So, that is the good news. The bad news is that it is likely an intermittent contact in the wiring to the clutch solenoid – which coincides with why you started this post off in the beginning. Having said “bad news” I reckon you like me would be happy with this outcome as it sure beats replacing the clutch slave. So, perhaps a second look at the clutch solenoid connections to prevent this intermittent issue catching you out on the open road. Cheers, Daryl

View attachment 457867

So looking back over this
Will the clutch solenoid valve show values other then 0 if sat in neutral tho? Which these tests was carried out not in gear so no clutch will be selected

 

[MSjoberg]

So looking back over this
Will the clutch solenoid valve show values other then 0 if sat in neutral tho? Which these tests was carried out not in gear so no clutch will be selected

I had a look into a datafile I saved during a testdrive 2023:

It shows other values than 0 (close to but not exactly the same as the "zero flow" value) if the clutch is pressed. I.e. during gear changes and at standstill in neutral if the engine is running.
It shows 0 in neutral if the engine is not running and also in all gears when driving with the clutch fully engaged.

 

[Seanwinder22]

I had a look into a datafile I saved during a testdrive 2023:

It shows other values than 0 (close to but not exactly the same as the "zero flow" value) if the clutch is pressed. I.e. during gear changes and at standstill in neutral if the engine is running.
It shows 0 in neutral if the engine is not running and also in all gears when driving with the clutch fully engaged.

Like this data you are correct

 

[Seanwinder22]

So time to carry out tests
maybe swap solenoid valves over would tell me if the solenoid is the only issue swap Evo0 and Evo3 over and start the van or like mentioned a short in the wiring
Which I have had issues with this harness before
But I think the best test would be on the solenoid

This Evo solenoid is actually the cheap fix at £140
The harness I need is now £350
So I hope it is the solenoid lol

 

[MSjoberg]

So time to carry out tests
maybe swap solenoid valves over would tell me if the solenoid is the only issue swap Evo0 and Evo3 over and start the van or like mentioned a short in the wiring
Which I have had issues with this harness before
But I think the best test would be on the solenoid

This Evo solenoid is actually the cheap fix at £140
The harness I need is now £350
So I hope it is the solenoid lol

Just in case you don't know this already: the solenoid valves are of two different types, "proportional flow" and "proportional pressure". So if you plan to swap EV0, there is only one to chose from! And yes, I think it's EV3. You can probably see this if they have visible part numbers.

 

[Seanwinder22]

Just in case you don't know this already: the solenoid valves are of two different types, "proportional flow" and "proportional pressure". So if you plan to swap EV0, there is only one to chose from! And yes, I think it's EV3. You can probably see this if they have visible part numbers.

Yes I understand what you are saying
2 are pressure solenoids which are Evo2 & 1
So Evo and Evo 3 are the same type
Like it explains in the image I posted that explains

1. Proportional flow solenoid for controlling the clutch (EV0)

2. Proportional pressure solenoid valve for even gear engagement (R - 2 - 4 - 6) (EV2)

3. Proportional pressure solenoid for odd gear engagement (1 - 3 - 5). (EV1)

4. Proportional flow solenoid for range selection (EV3)

 

[Seanwinder22]

I just wanted to finish off the thread has my issues are now sorted so thanks to those members that joined in especially pointing out the solenoid this really helped
So if you are at any time dropping on this thread read through from the start it should sort the issues you face

I will say this I’m glad I did my homework on the selespeed because they are all simple fixes because it’s sensors and solenoid that can all be reached and changed especially if you have mes software you are good to go and will save thousands lol trust me I had some horror stories that started August 2022
Garages want to just change clutch or selespeed robot
Thing is they change the clutch then issue still happen so then they say now we just need to change this sensor go look yourself at previous threads on motorhome groups you will find hundreds of them and in the end it was sensors or accumulator or solenoid a hour fix
Honestly download these links on this thread learn it and test it you will sort the issues good luck

 

[Seanwinder22]

no gears available check transmission??
You need diagnostic that can read gearbox so buy multiecuscan and check fault codes help put you in right place
Once connected clear codes and start van and run tests again looking if codes are back


If codes are back look on my other post and check what codes mean


I will say this I have owned comfortmatic many years now and had to learn myself otherwise you won't get far
This gearbox is still one of the best it's the
m40 gearbox and manual gearbox but fitted with a robot called cfc348 magnetti
This robot is basically your foot put it in simple terms that controls clutch for you

For the clutch to work its down to sensors and valves / solenoids etc that controls transmission so 98% of the time when we have issue with no gears is down to a sensor Clutch position sensor or gearbox sensor gear box rpm sensor pressure sensor

Oil pressure in transmission which needs the accumulator changing all these are very easy
fixes or low transmission oil a blown fuse or relay a bad ground or bad battery
Faulty solenoid valves which we have 4 in total Proportional flow solenoid for controlling the clutch (EVO)
Proportional pressure solenoid valve for even gear engagement (R - 2 - 4 - 6) (EV2)
Proportional pressure solenoid for odd gear engagement (1 - 3 - 5). (EV1)
Proportional flow solenoid for range selection (EV3)
THE REASON you need multiecuscan is to view live parameters while in the gearbox software is to check data which will show you hydraulic pressure and battery voltage and sensors all solenoids for gear selection and clutch selection


I found my issue instantly when I started van neutral was fine but when select first gear I Got no gears available so looking at data for odd gear solenoid current it shows 0 ma when other solenoid shows 982ma which my issue was broke contact pin on the harness that plugs to the Evol solenoid job complete I Had first gear


Then year later I Had issue again no gears available po805 which was clutch position sensor which I changed and fault cleared
One other issue was Evo valve which a member noticed again on multiecuscan which is this image I post look at Solenoid valve current at zero flow 982.8 mA THEN look second from bottom Clutch solenoid valve current 0.0mA which shows instantly no current from the solenoid valve which is not sending pressure to engage clutch
So I purchased another Evo solenoid valve
£140 job fixed no more issues
I will show a video how I changed this valve because you need to drain transmission oil first before removing valve then fit new oil then you need to clutch drain routine and a couple of routine calibration in mes also


Just remember keep this selespeed serviced and it will last a very long time keeping in mind an accumulator will last 10 year max so old van? Change it before it breaks and causes more issues
Pump relay
Transmission fluid every 2 years and clutch dot4
Drive the comfortmatic properly like red light don't sit gear engaged foot on brake go neutral handbrake on otherwise you ride the clutch
Treat it like a manual clutch
On hill neutral and handbrake don't hold with throttle

I have nothing left to post but because I built a YouTube channel to show anything on this robot I have started making videos on how to remove harness and check contacts
Then showing how to change each sensor or solenoid the relay and fuses etc etc so will take time taking one off at a time to video it but I have done a few videos to date
So give me some time and I will get around the complete robot on a video for each to help anyone at home to save you money

 

[Seanwinder22]

One thing I completely forgot to add that someone messaged me about today
The pump relay location I have absolutely no idea sorry on my ducato 59 plate 3.0 160 multijet I have not seen any relay
I have a fuse on mine 30 amp in the engine compartment I have fuse f24 f26 f27
in the same fuse box on a separate mini one another 3 fuses are here which is f26 for the pump and f27 but f26 is what I pulled when depressurised the system so I think it’s the face lift ducato that comes with a relay ? No idea honestly

 

[MSjoberg]

One thing I completely forgot to add that someone messaged me about today
The pump relay location I have absolutely no idea sorry on my ducato 59 plate 3.0 160 multijet I have not seen any relay
I have a fuse on mine 30 amp in the engine compartment I have fuse f24 f26 f27
in the same fuse box on a separate mini one another 3 fuses are here which is f26 for the pump and f27 but f26 is what I pulled when depressurised the system so I think it’s the face lift ducato that comes with a relay ? No idea honestly

The pre-facelift (2014) Ducato also has a pump relay. It might be J087 in the enclosed picture (shows left-hand drive, don't know if RHD differs in this respect)

(On the facelift version (X290) the relay is located on the optional extension board attached to the engine compartment fuse/relay board)

 

[Seanwinder22]

So if anyone with the pre lift can provide any information on this relay for the pump to this thread I think just about everything has been covered

I’ve just used mes to activate the pump and once I pressed execute I went to the engine compartment and can not hear a relay clicking from the fuse box location very strange

The pre-facelift (2014) Ducato also has a pump relay. It might be J087 in the enclosed picture (shows left-hand drive, don't know if RHD differs in this respect)

(On the facelift version (X290) the relay is located on the optional extension board attached to the engine compartment fuse/relay board)

yes I understand the x290 and the facelift 2014 do
But has I say from 2009 to 2014 rhd i cant find any information on the relay location
I 100% don’t have one unless it’s hard wired
I have the pump fuse but no relay I hear no clicking in the multiecuscan test either just the pump kicks in
Very strange