What's made you smile today?

[FiatMatt94]

Something on the car actually went to plan I removed the wishbone bracket which attaches to the anti roll bar to get the broken studs off both sides as it seems you can only get them from Poland for £65 each to which I thought stuff that , so I got my dremel out which I bought the other day, put the small cutting disc attachment onto the dremel, cut the top of the stud off which is welded to the bracket then banged it out with a small chisel & it fell out, then I wire wheeled both bracket & gave them a quick blowover to make them look better.

The new driveshaft has been dispatched so hopefully I won't have to wait too long & I can get her back together.

 

[Pugglt Auld Jock]

Something on the car actually went to plan I removed the wishbone bracket which attaches to the anti roll bar to get the broken studs off both sides as it seems you can only get them from Poland for £65 each to which I thought stuff that , so I got my dremel out which I bought the other day, put the small cutting disc attachment onto the dremel, cut the top of the stud off which is welded to the bracket then banged it out with a small chisel & it fell out, then I wire wheeled both bracket & gave them a quick blowover to make them look better.
View attachment 454263

The new driveshaft has been dispatched so hopefully I won't have to wait too long & I can get her back together.

Nice to see another clothes whirly being put to good use!

 

[FiatMatt94]

Nice to see another clothes whirly being put to good use!

The best thing for the job

 

[The Panda Nut]

If a garage or mechanic has 'improved' the vehicle, they are entitled to hold it until payment is made. Servicing is generally not considered improvement, but replacing brake pads would be.
We used to take post-dated cheques from regular trusted customers. The large garage I worked at, being in a rural market town, had in the past taken all sorts of livestock and produce as payment. The archives made interesting reading. e.g. "Two sheep taken as deposit against a new Land Rover" (Delivered direct to the market on a Wednesday morning, proceeds of sale became the deposit.)

Sort out the income and va Tax on that then if you like. LOL Value added. Well then which adds value to which?? Which came first the the chicken or the egg.

 

[The Panda Nut]

My youngest who is the new house owner came back from another session of cleaning and sanding earlier and announced she has bought her second tool. A crow bar.... Like fathe,r like daughter I suppose. The first one was a very sharp pruing saw when we were removing her hedge. I told her I would get there with the chainsaw but she wanted to get stuck in. At least thats done for now it topped out at 30 trailer loads. I still need to get the back hedge down another metre but that can wait till she is in the house. I reckon another 4 loads for that and another 4 to get rid of the side hedhe when we remove it. New fence and a Yew hedge I think easier to manage. Thats pretty impressive from a garden thats about 40' wide and 24' deep. As can imagine its a tad lighter in the house now.

 

[StevenRB45]

I suspected the alignment on the Toyota was a bit out..

Just a smudge.

That explains the epic tyre noise at 60 then...

All straightened out and straight off to Hamsterly forest.

Now a much nicer place to be at national limit though yet to hit 70 however it used to emit a very weird (it's probably the sound of the road sanding the tyres off...) tyre related noise at 60 which has buggered off.

 

[bugsymike]

Re customers trying to escape payment.
When I went self employed I chose my customers as much as they chose me.
I said, this is the labour rate, I will only charge the hours I work on your vehicle , parts are at retail price, I will do your vehicle as quick as possible and in return you will pay as soon as job is completed and I contact you!!!
In around 40 years I had three bouncing cheques and got every one back!
The reason being all my customers were known by another customer as they all came to me by personal recommendation.

 

[Pugglt Auld Jock]

My youngest who is the new house owner came back from another session of cleaning and sanding earlier and announced she has bought her second tool. A crow bar.... Like fathe,r like daughter I suppose. The first one was a very sharp pruing saw when we were removing her hedge. I told her I would get there with the chainsaw but she wanted to get stuck in. At least thats done for now it topped out at 30 trailer loads. I still need to get the back hedge down another metre but that can wait till she is in the house. I reckon another 4 loads for that and another 4 to get rid of the side hedhe when we remove it. New fence and a Yew hedge I think easier to manage. Thats pretty impressive from a garden thats about 40' wide and 24' deep. As can imagine its a tad lighter in the house now.

Always surprising how much volume there is in stuff like this. I remember cutting back a couple of very big Rhododendrons on one of the properties we looked after when I had the gardening squad and it took about 6 trips with our LDV crewcab pickup full to the top and then some all tied down with a net and rope over the top. Glad the "Plod" didn't see us! It looked like a big jelly wobbling away in my rear view mirror!

 

[PuntoHowTo]

The garage I use now for my Golf (as I’ve owned it from new and want to keep a full documented history)

Is a family run business, they are not cheap, you always have to book an appointment, but they are the sort of place that if you book a service they don’t just look at stuff, everything that should be serviced, lubricated, or cleaned gets done, they do all the work on the day and they are VW specialists who only ever use genuine parts. So I really don’t mind paying more.

In the past I had used no end of garages for various stuff and the amount of times I felt ripped off or like they had done a bad job, or they screwed something up etc it is just not worth trying to save a penny when you find someone good.

I always pay whenever I pick up the car up and they wouldn’t mess me around I am not going to mess them around, it’s a relationship that works for both of us. It can be quite a while to get booked in sometimes so you know they are busy.

 

[bugsymike]

The garage I use now for my Golf (as I’ve owned it from new and want to keep a full documented history)

Is a family run business, they are not cheap, you always have to book an appointment, but they are the sort of place that if you book a service they don’t just look at stuff, everything that should be serviced, lubricated, or cleaned gets done, they do all the work on the day and they are VW specialists who only ever use genuine parts. So I really don’t mind paying more.

In the past I had used no end of garages for various stuff and the amount of times I felt ripped off or like they had done a bad job, or they screwed something up etc it is just not worth trying to save a penny when you find someone good.

I always pay whenever I pick up the car up and they wouldn’t mess me around I am not going to mess them around, it’s a relationship that works for both of us. It can be quite a while to get booked in sometimes so you know they are busy.

My sisters live to far away for me to do their vehicles, so I say to them , find a good garage and stay with them .
Loyalty works both ways.
A friend of my ex wife got me to do odd jobs for him on his car until he asked me to fix work done by another garage when I thought he was bringing his car to me!
So that ended that!!!

 

[Pugglt Auld Jock]

My sisters live to far away for me to do their vehicles, so I say to them , find a good garage and stay with them .
Loyalty works both ways.
A friend of my ex wife got me to do odd jobs for him on his car until he asked me to fix work done by another garage when I thought he was bringing his car to me!
So that ended that!!!

I'm happy to echo that advice Mike. The problem for folk who know little about cars is finding that good garage of course.

There's nothing worse than having to sort out someone else's mess is there. It's worth saying perhaps, that this is a factor less able/skilled DIYers should consider as if you attempt a task which really is beyond you and you "marmelize" something to the extent that you have to hand it over to a "professional" it may well cost you a considerable amount for them to repair the mayhem you've wrought. For instance, say you snap a manifold stud in a cylinder head where there's insufficient clearance to get a drill or any sort of extracting tool in place. Could be that the head will have to come off so you can work on it! Mind you I'm a fine one to give this advice considering the number of things I've messed up beyond all hope of repair during my earlier amateur meddlings! Later in my professional life, when it was my call as to whether we'd undertake work like this, I very soon realized you had to be very careful when people, not unreasonably, wanted you to give a binding price quote for the work. I simply would not do this and instead would advise what our hourly rate was and that it would cost what it would cost - with the reassurance that I promised we would keep costs as low as possible. Many people would not find this acceptable so didn't get us to do the work which was fine by me as we were never short of work and could do without the "agro" anyway.

 

[bugsymike]

I'm happy to echo that advice Mike. The problem for folk who know little about cars is finding that good garage of course.

There's nothing worse than having to sort out someone else's mess is there. It's worth saying perhaps, that this is a factor less able/skilled DIYers should consider as if you attempt a task which really is beyond you and you "marmelize" something to the extent that you have to hand it over to a "professional" it may well cost you a considerable amount for them to repair the mayhem you've wrought. For instance, say you snap a manifold stud in a cylinder head where there's insufficient clearance to get a drill or any sort of extracting tool in place. Could be that the head will have to come off so you can work on it! Mind you I'm a fine one to give this advice considering the number of things I've messed up beyond all hope of repair during my earlier amateur meddlings! Later in my professional life, when it was my call as to whether we'd undertake work like this, I very soon realized you had to be very careful when people, not unreasonably, wanted you to give a binding price quote for the work. I simply would not do this and instead would advise what our hourly rate was and that it would cost what it would cost - with the reassurance that I promised we would keep costs as low as possible. Many people would not find this acceptable so didn't get us to do the work which was fine by me as we were never short of work and could do without the "agro" anyway.

100% agree @Pugglt Auld Jock several years ago I saw a neighbour working on his Lancia, I didn't get involved , but he knew I was a skilled motor engineer,. He obviously wanted no assistance whilst working on his steering.
Shortly after I saw it being towed to a scrapyard and he bought another vehicle, I later learnt the reason was, he couldn't free off the taper on a track rod end!!!
If he had asked, one blow from my hammer would have done it.
Same as you, I would give an estimate, but not a quote. Although I always took my customers telephone number and if something unforeseen occurred I would contact them for permission to continue. In general whilst they appreciated my call, their reply was always "go ahead".
When pricing for a job there is never a guarantee you will get the work.
I recall pricing a clutch job on a Fiat 131 in the late 80s and telling the customer there was a choice of clutch type and price on that model.
Shortly after when filling up with fuel at another I saw the car on their ramp and had a "chat", the clutch was the cheaper one but they got the job by cutting my price and then telling the owner it needed the more expensive clutch!

 

[porta]

100% agree @Pugglt Auld Jock several years ago I saw a neighbour working on his Lancia, I didn't get involved , but he knew I was a skilled motor engineer,. He obviously wanted no assistance whilst working on his steering.
Shortly after I saw it being towed to a scrapyard and he bought another vehicle, I later learnt the reason was, he couldn't free off the taper on a track rod end!!!
If he had asked, one blow from my hammer would have done it.
Same as you, I would give an estimate, but not a quote. Although I always took my customers telephone number and if something unforeseen occurred I would contact them for permission to continue. In general whilst they appreciated my call, their reply was always "go ahead".
When pricing for a job there is never a guarantee you will get the work.
I recall pricing a clutch job on a Fiat 131 in the late 80s and telling the customer there was a choice of clutch type and price on that model.
Shortly after when filling up with fuel at another I saw the car on their ramp and had a "chat", the clutch was the cheaper one but they got the job by cutting my price and then telling the owner it needed the more expensive clutch!

We had a 141 panda 4x4 come in for a ‘knocking at rear’ it was found to be the exhaust ‘fitting where it touched’. Customer rung, complained that ‘as it was a Fiat bit, we should replace under part’s warranty’. The customer was livid wehn we told him to take it where it was fitted, turned out it was a Ti exhaust fitted at a ford dealership! Moreover, it cost more than the Fiat Ricambi part

 

[Pugglt Auld Jock]

100% agree @Pugglt Auld Jock several years ago I saw a neighbour working on his Lancia, I didn't get involved , but he knew I was a skilled motor engineer,. He obviously wanted no assistance whilst working on his steering.
Shortly after I saw it being towed to a scrapyard and he bought another vehicle, I later learnt the reason was, he couldn't free off the taper on a track rod end!!!
If he had asked, one blow from my hammer would have done it.
Same as you, I would give an estimate, but not a quote. Although I always took my customers telephone number and if something unforeseen occurred I would contact them for permission to continue. In general whilst they appreciated my call, their reply was always "go ahead".
When pricing for a job there is never a guarantee you will get the work.
I recall pricing a clutch job on a Fiat 131 in the late 80s and telling the customer there was a choice of clutch type and price on that model.
Shortly after when filling up with fuel at another I saw the car on their ramp and had a "chat", the clutch was the cheaper one but they got the job by cutting my price and then telling the owner it needed the more expensive clutch!

Sad to say, but probably the breakers was the best place for it - ouch - as he'd have been tipping a lot more money down that particular "hole" in the near future?

Keeping customers informed and NEVER doing stuff they hadn't been notified of was something I always tried to do. I've heard so often of someone who has dropped their car off for a full service and found they're in the hole for a full brake rebuild, maybe not just pads/linings but calipers and cylinders too without them having been asked. It alienates your customer and adds to the already shocking opinion that many motorists have that the garage trade are just a load of thieving sharks. I might have gone as far as to fit a set of pads if I couldn't raise the customer but wouldn't have done the disks and rears too and/or calipers without getting permission. Sometimes made life difficult for me as it could tie up a ramp I needed, but I'd rather put the wheels back on and wheel it to one side than risk disenfranchising a good customer.

 

[Pugglt Auld Jock]

We had a 141 panda 4x4 come in for a ‘knocking at rear’ it was found to be the exhaust ‘fitting where it touched’. Customer rung, complained that ‘as it was a Fiat bit, we should replace under part’s warranty’. The customer was livid wehn we told him to take it where it was fitted, turned out it was a Ti exhaust fitted at a ford dealership! Moreover, it cost more than the Fiat Ricambi part

Of course fitting exhausts was a major part of the business at the Tyre and Auto store. We very rarely fitted genuine exhaust parts and carried basically two options for customers. A "cheapo" product with just mild steel tubing and basic silencer/resonator boxes and a more expensive, but much better value, aluminised system with double skinned boxes etc. The more expensive system was far better value as it lasted much longer but some folk would only buy the cheapest so we carried them or risked loosing the business. One of my bugbears was a customer coming back with a badly fitted system which was knocking on the chassis/axle/etc. So, every new man I employed I would supervise the first two or three systems he did and I was amazed at how few, so called skilled fitters, were able to fit a system properly. The big thing being to renew any dodgy hangers and then fit it all together loosely and get it all aligned before tightening any clamps and brackets - it's not rocket science. The more expensive product was usually shaped well but the bends on some of the "cheapo" parts were nowhere even near what they should be and even comparing say half a dozen back boxes and pipes the difference in the pipe bends could be considerable. I think, with exhausts, you tend to get very much what you pay for! I was for ever sending some of the cheapo parts back when the next delivery truck came round as I refused to waste time and oxy-acetylene on trying to "modify" their poor product.

 

[portland_bill]

Of course fitting exhausts was a major part of the business at the Tyre and Auto store. We very rarely fitted genuine exhaust parts and carried basically two options for customers. A "cheapo" product with just mild steel tubing and basic silencer/resonator boxes and a more expensive, but much better value, aluminised system with double skinned boxes etc. The more expensive system was far better value as it lasted much longer but some folk would only buy the cheapest so we carried them or risked loosing the business. One of my bugbears was a customer coming back with a badly fitted system which was knocking on the chassis/axle/etc. So, every new man I employed I would supervise the first two or three systems he did and I was amazed at how few, so called skilled fitters, were able to fit a system properly. The big thing being to renew any dodgy hangers and then fit it all together loosely and get it all aligned before tightening any clamps and brackets - it's not rocket science. The more expensive product was usually shaped well but the bends on some of the "cheapo" parts were nowhere even near what they should be and even comparing say half a dozen back boxes and pipes the difference in the pipe bends could be considerable. I think, with exhausts, you tend to get very much what you pay for! I was for ever sending some of the cheapo parts back when the next delivery truck came round as I refused to waste time and oxy-acetylene on trying to "modify" their poor product.

Exhausts used to be a regular replacement, but with catalysts, the exhaust runs hotter, and heats up faster, so even on short runs not much condensation is left inside. Downside is that with a significantly reduced demand, aftermarket suppliers are disappearing, and OE will make no longer available sooner. Then choice becomes limited, and quality generally poorer. One of the reasons, quite a few years ago now, I had a stainless system made for the Panda.
Two exhaust stories. When working at a large Rover dealer, we of course sold Unipart exhausts, which came with a 2-yr warranty. Sold well, except into Swanage. A small seaside town, where the locals don't travel far, so fill their back boxes with condensation, rotting them out very quickly. So the garages in that area preferred to fit cheap silencers, and often. "The last thing we need is a long warranty."
When I was running a Fiat Argenta, an OE exhaust was only a few quid more than any aftermarket system, so I got OE. A front pipe, twin branch to a Y-piece, then a pipe back to the first box, over the axle to a rear box. Simple. After only a few weeks, it started to blow at the Y-joint. Poor welds. Local Fiat dealer were not allowed to splash some weld on, so under warranty, they replaced the front section. One of the rubber hangers broke by the time I got home. The front pipe was so misaligned it was trying to exit ahead of the rear wheel, so one hanger was taking a lot of strain, lasting about 20 miles. Took a bit of arguing about that one, I got to replace the hanger twice a day, at home and at work, for three days, until the next replacement arrived. They gave me a bagful of hangers. I got used to heaving against the wheel to get it into position. Next replacement fitted well, but again the welds at the Y-piece failed, after about 6 weeks. While grovelling underneath to identify where, I was met with a glaring hole in the sill, like older Fiats used to. Had enough, went looking for another car, came back with a Panda 750.

 

[bugsymike]

Exhausts used to be a regular replacement, but with catalysts, the exhaust runs hotter, and heats up faster, so even on short runs not much condensation is left inside. Downside is that with a significantly reduced demand, aftermarket suppliers are disappearing, and OE will make no longer available sooner. Then choice becomes limited, and quality generally poorer. One of the reasons, quite a few years ago now, I had a stainless system made for the Panda.
Two exhaust stories. When working at a large Rover dealer, we of course sold Unipart exhausts, which came with a 2-yr warranty. Sold well, except into Swanage. A small seaside town, where the locals don't travel far, so fill their back boxes with condensation, rotting them out very quickly. So the garages in that area preferred to fit cheap silencers, and often. "The last thing we need is a long warranty."
When I was running a Fiat Argenta, an OE exhaust was only a few quid more than any aftermarket system, so I got OE. A front pipe, twin branch to a Y-piece, then a pipe back to the first box, over the axle to a rear box. Simple. After only a few weeks, it started to blow at the Y-joint. Poor welds. Local Fiat dealer were not allowed to splash some weld on, so under warranty, they replaced the front section. One of the rubber hangers broke by the time I got home. The front pipe was so misaligned it was trying to exit ahead of the rear wheel, so one hanger was taking a lot of strain, lasting about 20 miles. Took a bit of arguing about that one, I got to replace the hanger twice a day, at home and at work, for three days, until the next replacement arrived. They gave me a bagful of hangers. I got used to heaving against the wheel to get it into position. Next replacement fitted well, but again the welds at the Y-piece failed, after about 6 weeks. While grovelling underneath to identify where, I was met with a glaring hole in the sill, like older Fiats used to. Had enough, went looking for another car, came back with a Panda 750.

I agree about hotter exhausts , I remember on Morris 1000 the exhausts used to last a very long time, the reason being the silencer was less than 2 foot from the exhaust manifold, unlike things like Peugeots that I was always replacing due to the silencer box being after the back axle.
When working for a Lada Dealership the exhaust systems were cheaper price and much heavier build quality than pattern exhausts that the motor factors supplied and fitted well. It took a while before local traders caught on.

 

[StevenRB45]

Exhaust heat might be helping to point, but I think mainly most manufacturers have switched to low grade stainless for factory systems.

We had a Pug 307 many years ago it had a Cat....the exhaust lasted 3 years 1 month. The exhaust on the C3 is still factory original although it had a few new brackets since.

This under the Toyota though...this is pre them cleaning up the rear beam so you can see the impact road salt, water and time has had on the painted surfaces. Note the unpainted exhaust there's no way that's mild steel after 8 years.

Could be a combo of the cat cleaning up the more acidic emissions, also turbos do raise exhaust gas temps further...but I do think a lot of manufacturers quietly changed to stainless exhausts. My Suzuki (2006) had a Stainless exhaust from factory as did Mazda.

 

[vexorg]

I'm surprised my citroen is still on the original exhaust, and that's 13 years old now and doesn't look too bad. I think you are right and they have done something with newer exhaust metal.

 

[bugsymike]

One of my customers had a Toyota Carina from new, when the exhaust started to feel it's age after over ten years he asked me to fit a genuine system even though it was about three times the cost and this was pre cat's etc.
I was well impressed with the quality of it.
By the way , I thought it was manufacturers making the exhaust "aluminiumised". As they didn't like being welded much.
After he retired, I haven't seen him for over 15 years , but he and his wife still send me Christmas cards.