Technical Horrendously stuck bolt in sump, been working on it for 3 days, any ideas?

[Ralf S.]

The sump on Rasputin was a PITA to remove and that's with all the bolts coming out reasonably painlessly. A couple started to burr up but anyways came out okay.

The sump itself had to be teased off using every pry bar in my possession and suffered fatal deformation during the process (someone had welded up some rust holes (really! ) so it was leaking and scrap anyway.

My view is that once stuck on, the gasket goo alone would be enough to hold the sump in place, although I guess over time and unscrewing the sump plug enough times would eventually have it start leaking.

Anyhow... bottom line is Life is too short. Unless you have a fetish for this kind of thing (i.e. aged under 50) I would just smooth down that area and fit the new sump with the remaining bolts. Use a bit more RTV on the dodgy corner to allow for any face damage.. perhaps hold it under tension while it sets, using a block of wood on a jack maybe.... but I think the other bolts will do the job and while this might be fulfilling to resolve.. it's probably more of PITA than the bang you will get out of it..


Ralf S.

 

[spleenharvester]

I'm starting to lean that way too - all these attempts to pull it out are just making the surface worse. I think I am just going to try one more time with a carbide bit and if not, repair the mating surface best I can and just cross my fingers. There's that 8mm nut next to it too after all.

 

[steveras57]

If it nags at ya once done, ya can always sell it!! to be honest after this saga the scrappage scheme might be the best option! sorry!

 

[AnthonyH]

I'm starting to lean that way too - all these attempts to pull it out are just making the surface worse. I think I am just going to try one more time with a carbide bit and if not, repair the mating surface best I can and just cross my fingers. There's that 8mm nut next to it too after all.

Looks like the way to go. It will likely be fine without that bolt. The worst case scenario is that you have to take the sump off again, which will require a new one. But at £40 on ebay its still a lot cheaper than taking it to a garage. I was quoted £350 for a sump replacement and ended up doing it myself, it took me ages but thankfully I didn't have anything like this.

 

[jrkitching]

If it nags at ya once done, ya can always sell it

Seems to me that the previous owner did exactly that.

 

[Cornish Ian]

Cobalt bit can't do it either guys, glows red hot and just won't go through. Is carbide likely to be any better?

3mm DeWalt Extreme cobalt.

Sounds like you are running your drill much too fast.

 

[porta]

These, are better than cobalt and have a pilot point for ease of first cut. The bit set has normal circular shanks upto 5mm and tri-sided shanks over that, which means you can get upto 15mm drills in a standard cordless ratchet chuck

Dewalt DW1361 Titanium Drill Bit Set​

 

[bugsymike]

These, are better than cobalt and have a pilot point for ease of first cut. The bit set has normal circular shanks upto 5mm and tri-sided shanks over that, which means you can get upto 15mm drills in a standard cordless ratchet chuck

Dewalt DW1361 Titanium Drill Bit Set​

Bit of a pain when it jams and you are spinning around on the drill.
I fitted a small Hiab to an Iveco Crewcab tipper pick up using blacksmith stepped up drill sizes (3/4 in 1/2 inch chuck) on large mains powered drill, got some good knocks doing it but nothing broke on me, though the chineses drill bits bent. I think the Iveco chassis was possibly high tensile steel

 

[porta]

Bit of a pain when it jams and you are spinning around on the drill.
I fitted a small Hiab to an Iveco Crewcab tipper pick up using blacksmith stepped up drill sizes (3/4 in 1/2 inch chuck) on large mains powered drill, got some good knocks doing it but nothing broke on me, though the chineses drill bits bent. I think the Iveco chassis was possibly high tensile steel

The iveco chassis, certainly upto Mk3 were very robust, the powder coating, as with a lot of chassis built manufacturers, esp the mercs, soon flaked off though. The Daily 4x4 chassis was even more robust

 

[bugsymike]

The iveco chassis, certainly upto Mk3 were very robust, the powder coating, as with a lot of chassis built manufacturers, esp the mercs, soon flaked off though. The Daily 4x4 chassis was even more robust

Only problem was with Hiab, tipper and crewcab payload was 300Kgs for 3.5 tonne pick up.

 

[John202020]

Would try the sealant only route first?
Do you think there's enough block, that's safe to drill, two 4mm holes either side of the area? So you can use two small bolt/screws to provide sealing force?
You'd only need 10mm deep at 4/5mm dia? And two new holes in the sump pan?

 

[Jockstrap]

I'm starting to lean that way too - all these attempts to pull it out are just making the surface worse. I think I am just going to try one more time with a carbide bit and if not, repair the mating surface best I can and just cross my fingers. There's that 8mm nut next to it too after all.

Look at your end objective.
Go the sealant route with a decent bead, but don't torque up fully on the nuts until ,"set".
Doesn't work? Plan b.
Plan B. Continue drilling ( yup I think are too fast and little pressure) not to red hot. If this doesn't work where do you go? Drill in the hole or worse.
Anyway, take a break, have a dram and don't rush it.
Regards

 

[vexorg]

Sounds like you are running your drill much too fast.

That was my thought reading that too.
What size drill was it?

 

[spleenharvester]

That was my thought reading that too.
What size drill was it?

It was a dremel with the extension cord as that's the only thing I can maneuver into the space. You are quite right I was running it way too fast. I'll try much slower today.

My plan currently is just to try and extract with an LH drill bit, and if that fails I'm going to attempt to seal without the bolt using Dirko. If that fails I think I will look at taking it into the garage to see if they can come up with something as it's probably out of my ability at that point.

 

[porta]

It was a dremel with the extension cord as that's the only thing I can maneuver into the space. You are quite right I was running it way too fast. I'll try much slower today.

My plan currently is just to try and extract with an LH drill bit, and if that fails I'm going to attempt to seal without the bolt using Dirko. If that fails I think I will look at taking it into the garage to see if they can come up with something as it's probably out of my ability at that point.

The one thing I miss from my motortrade days, a two post ramp. It’s certainly no fun laying on cold concrete, with the car on domestic ramps or axle stands, trying to get an awkward bugger owt

 

[spleenharvester]

The one thing I miss from my motortrade days, a two post ramp. It’s certainly no fun laying on cold concrete, with the car on domestic ramps or axle stands, trying to get an awkward bugger owt

Haha yep it's been absolutely soaking the past week here in Nottingham. Nothing like having to lay down on asphalt covered in rain and oil.

The main problem though is that the front axle and flywheel is blocking me from getting a full size drill in place at a right angle. Dremel extension isn't perfect either but it's fairly close to 90*.

 

[porta]

Haha yep it's been absolutely soaking the past week here in Nottingham. Nothing like having to lay down on asphalt covered in rain and oil.

The main problem though is that the front axle and flywheel is blocking me from getting a full size drill in place at a right angle. Dremel extension isn't perfect either but it's fairly close to 90*.

We had two days without rain in the past 8 weeks…they never get the weather right in the Pennines even the barn has been underwater more often than not

 

[Cornish Ian]

It was a dremel with the extension cord as that's the only thing I can maneuver into the space. You are quite right I was running it way too fast. I'll try much slower today.

My plan currently is just to try and extract with an LH drill bit, and if that fails I'm going to attempt to seal without the bolt using Dirko. If that fails I think I will look at taking it into the garage to see if they can come up with something as it's probably out of my ability at that point.

I suspect you might have a problem starting your drilling now as there is a very good chance you have work hardened the material with your previous efforts. It will only be a very thin layer but very hard.
It might be worth trying to remove a small amount of material from where you were drilling with a very small pointed grind stone if you can.
Drill very slowly with a sharp bit using as much pressure as you can without bending the bit, some lubrication might help, preferably use a small bit to break through the hard surface.

 

[Cornish Ian]

I suspect you might have a problem starting your drilling now as there is a very good chance you have work hardened the material with your previous efforts. It will only be a very thin layer but very hard.
It might be worth trying to remove a small amount of material from where you were drilling with a very small pointed grind stone if you can.
Drill very slowly with a sharp bit using as much pressure as you can without bending the bit, some lubrication might help, preferably use a small bit to break through the hard surface.

One more thought, if you fail to drill out the existing bolt / weld or whatever it is, is there room to drill and tap holes either side of the old bolt. (Assuming no webs or oil ways).

 

[vexorg]

A dremmel is way to fast, and I'd be concerned about the amount of force I put on it.