Technical Engine oil again

[fiat_freak]

Am putting this on both the GP and the Panda sites as it’s relevant to both models.

We own a 2009 Grande Punto 1.4 Active and a 2011 Panda 1.2 Active ECO. They both do just 5,000 kms. per annum as we are retired living in Cornwall. They have an easy life and neither car does any prolonged high-speed or long distance motoring.

The GP has had two services by Fiat (both using Selenia K Pure energy 5W40, which is a very expensive fully synthetic oil) and the Panda will get at least one similar Fiat service to preserve Fiat’s warranty before I start doing my own basic servicing. Both cars have the well proven FIRE series engines.

This new synthetic KPE oil appeared when Euro 5 spec came in with the drive for better fuel economies/lower emissions. Fiat used to recommend Selenia 20K 10W40 semi-synthetic and certainly our old Mk.1 Punto, which was serviced exclusively on semi-synthetic oils equivalent to Selenia 20K) is still on the road after 14 years and 70k miles and the engine still seems perfect.

So now we come to decision time. What to do for future maintenance? Do we pay for Selenia KPE at about £50 for a 5-litre pot? Or do we use tried and trusted oils to the Selenia 20K spec (such as GM’s own for less than £20 delivered per 5 litre)?

What’s the difference in specs?
Selenia KPE raises the ACEA spec from A3 to C3 and the API spec from SL/CF to SM/CF. What do these entail?

ACEA C3 Fiat claim is “especially formulated to maximise fuel economy, warrant compliance with anti-pollution regulation, protect engines created to operate at ever higher temperatures and enhance the typically sporty character in turbocharged versions.”

API SM - Introduced November 2004 –gives “improved oxidation resistance, deposit protection and wear protection, also better low temperature performance over the life of the oil compared to previous categories”.

For the life of me I can not see why these simple FIRE engines (and the way we use our cars) can need the “higher-temperature or turbo-charging characteristics” from ACEA C3 and given basic semi-synthetic Selenia K is good for 20,000 km (and ours will be changed at 5000 km max) its life seems more than adequate.

So I believe I will be using a 10W40 semi-synthetic to ACEA A3 and API SL/CF with regular oil and filter changes until such time as Selenia sell their oils for a sensible price.

 

[pandissimo]

"Selenia KPE raises the ACEA spec from A3 to C3 and the API spec from SL/CF to SM/CF. What do these entail?"

Low ash formulations. Have a Google for the ACEA specs. There's also another thread on here with much the same questions. 10W40 semi-synth is fine, and especially if you buy it at Halford's two-for-one offer. No turbo-charger, no diesel particulate filter, and little need for extreme eco-motoring (thin oil and funny tyres) is a blessing.

 

[David C]

Plenty of other ACEA C3 spec 5W40 many with FIAT 9.55535-S2 approval too.
You do not need to use Selenia.

Opie have 6L of Fuchs TITAN GT1 XTL 5W-40 synthetic for £29 at the moment.
Or 4L of Castrol Magnatec 5W-40 C3 Fully Synthetic for £24.

So no need to spend £50...

 

[David Bliss]

I ran all my cars over the past 50 years, until I bought a Panda 3 years ago, on an agricultural 15/40 oil, now called Harvella. Some engines were high performance (for the time), others were vintage or veteran. I have had Fiats for over 20 years (Uno, Seicento and now Panda).
It wasn't until I bought the Panda that I changed to Helix Plus 10/40, as I was told that the engine tolerances had been reduced and it was advisable to use the thinner oil. The Helix, as I buy it in 20 litre drums, is at least half the price of the Selenia but the specs are very high.
It is always important to use a good oil, but particularly important if you only do a low mileage.

 

[R1NGA]

In my view the most important thing in relation to an engines life is how often you change the oil, not what oil you use (within reason). There's nothing worse for an engine than having ancient oil sludging around in the sump forever. I ran a 200Tdi Discovery for nearly 300,000 miles by changing the oil every 6000 regardless of the elapsed time. Sometimes that was only 6 weeks in the busy driving periods, but it makes all the difference. It popped a cambelt (despite changing those at 50% of the recommended interval too, but that's another story) at 250,000 and the bores were utterly unmarked. Close your eyes and draw a finger over the top of the bores and you could still not feel where the pistons had been turning round. Remarkable. Oh, and a decent magnetic sump plug too....!

So personally I'd stick with the cheaper semi stuff and change it twice as often. Minimum once/year or 6000 miles as far as I am concerned.

 

[fiat_freak]

Many thanks for all the comments. You have certainly help make up my mind to carry on as I did in the past with a good quality semi-synthetic to the right spec with regular low-mileage/annual changes of oil and filter. I have found GM’s own semi 10W40 to ACEA A3 and API SL a good buy at around £16 per 5 litres incl. delivery and have used that in the past with no problems.

David C your link to Fuchs was most useful as I found their semi Titan XTR 10W40 for £14.35/5litres (plus delivery) also conforms to ACEA A3 and API SL. A good contender

David B Your link to Shell Helix Plus semi 10W40 also confirms ACEA A3 and API SL but slightly more expensive at £21 per 5 litres incl. delivery.

Thanks also to Mozella over on the GP group for his comments at https://www.fiatforum.com/grande-punto/292932-engine-oil-again.html

Happy motoring to all

Ricky