Technical Ducato DPF errors

[Jamesbil]

Hi all new here,
Looking for some help with my 2017 2.3 130 non adblue manual Ducato

Bit of history,
I bought it form Main dealer with 205k KLM on the clock, fsh.
Had a new engine courtesy of Fiat at 165k (I assume bare bones engine)
202k had full service incl DPF remove and clean
At 209k I started getting limp mode and MIL.
Error was p2002 read with a launch reader. Wouldn't stay clear.
Forced regen and stayed clear for 150klm
Error p1206-22 read with MultiEcuScan. Comes back after 8-10klm
Van has the updated sensor and up to date software, 0032.
Any ideas?
I will post some pics of readings from my phone.

Thanks
James

 

[Jamesbil]

Hi all new here,
Looking for some help with my 2017 2.3 130 non adblue manual Ducato

Bit of history,
I bought it form Main dealer with 205k KLM on the clock, fsh.
Had a new engine courtesy of Fiat at 165k (I assume bare bones engine)
202k had full service incl DPF remove and clean
At 209k I started getting limp mode and MIL.
Error was p2002 read with a launch reader. Wouldn't stay clear.
Forced regen and stayed clear for 150klm
Error p1206-22 read with MultiEcuScan. Comes back after 8-10klm
Van has the updated sensor and up to date software, 0032.
Any ideas?
I will post some pics of readings from my phone.

Thanks
James

 

[theoneandonly]

James
There's another thread on here relating to dpf/egr errors on this specific twin egr engine. I will have a look at your codes

Ducato P0401 P0402 P0236 P0238 and limp mode its 2017 Euro 6, EGR changed, What do I check next | FIAT Ducato

Van is 2017 Euro 6 bought new , now with 26K on clock. Problems started this summer with dash engine light and code P0401 appeared on a country lane at low speed going into a corner so it would be low airflow going in to the engine as it wasn’t ‘working’. Bought FCR and cleared fault, happened...

www.fiatforum.com

 

[theoneandonly]

Fiat 2 P1206 Resistance to air flow in high particulate filter (first level)
Fiat 2 P2002 Resistance to air flow in high particulate filter, Plausibility
A question, which updated sensor?
Is your Exhaust pipe clear or sooty or oily

 

[Jamesbil]

Fiat 2 P1206 Resistance to air flow in high particulate filter (first level)
Fiat 2 P2002 Resistance to air flow in high particulate filter, Plausibility
A question, which updated sensor?
Is your Exhaust pipe clear or sooty or oily

Differential pressure sensor is current version.
Exhaust is clear. Slightly grubby on a white kitchen towel but not sooty, black or oily at all.

 

[theoneandonly]

What value are you getting from your sensor Some info i found
What is an acceptable figure for DPF Differential Pressure? The answer is as little as possible.
Adding back pressure will make the engine work harder, and use more fuel to deliver the same power.

<20 Brilliant DPF causing almost no restriction
20-99 Good result and typical of a DPF in good working order
100-250 DPF causing up to 0.25 BAR of pressure – needs investigation
250-500 Serious restriction probably not allowing car to do a Forced Regen
500-1000 Performance loss very marked at this level
>1000 Car can’t pull the proverbial skin off a rice pudding. All your boost is stuck in the DPF

 

[Jamesbil]

It reads 43mbar at idle

 

[theoneandonly]

Of the small number of Ducatos I know they all have idle values less than 10, 43 @ 2000rpm OK. Things point to a blocked dpf. Have you got the dpf Regeneration info : temperature, distance between regen etc

 

[Jamesbil]

Of the small number of Ducatos I know they all have idle values less than 10, 43 @ 2000rpm OK. Things point to a blocked dpf. Have you got the dpf Regeneration info : temperature, distance between regen etc

Yes, all that info is in the third pic I posted above, dpf temp 205c, 228c after filter. only 151klm average between. Says clogging is 68%

 

[theoneandonly]

James
sorry for missing the data you already sent. One problem i have is the general quality of screen photographs and glare. It is
easy to avoid these problems by screen capture, even easier than taking a photo.
The simplest screen capture method maybe
Press Alt and PrintScreen keys together, this this captures the screen to the clipboard.
Press Windows Logo Key and PrintScreen keys together, this this captures the screen to the screenshots directory under usr pictures as a screenshot(x).png file.
It looks as if you have a blocked dpf the distance between regens is 94miles whereas 250 to 300 is more normal.
What is causing your excessive sooting is another question. Do not do a forced regen, i have read that this does not "help" dpfs and more than 2 could destroy the dpf. I seen a youtube of someone in Ireland (o rileys) cleaning a dpf in situ using Vetech professional dpf cleaner by pumping in via the dpf differential sensor pipework.

 

[Jamesbil]

Thanks for the tips. I'll see if I can get in touch with them, have you any more info? Only o rileys I can see is Luton.
These guys do it for €200 once it is removed, but how big a job is that? https://www.dpfservice.ie/
So first step, get it cleaned? Then try to find the problem?
Or these guys? https://the-dpf-doctor.com/

 

[theoneandonly]

Thanks for the tips. I'll see if I can get in touch with them, have you any more info? Only o rileys I can see is Luton.
These guys do it for €200 once it is removed, but how big a job is that? https://www.dpfservice.ie/
So first step, get it cleaned? Then try to find the problem?
Or these guys? https://the-dpf-doctor.com/

A classic piece of sterotyping i'm afraid (says a Welshman called John Smith living in Northampton) yes followed the trail they are in Bedford.
Dont know how easy it is to remove.

 

[Jamesbil]

Just plugged in to read the Differential pressure sensor
It reads (van hasn't been driven today)
0mbar with engine off
19mbar at idle
105mbar at 2000revs (read 55 at first but then 105 after I revved it a couple of times.
DPF status is Normal Clogging and 70.5% clogging
Lambda oxygen concentration is 11.8% and 100% after DPF

Atmospheric pressure was 1012mbar.

Does this give any insight?

 

[theoneandonly]

From your data you are regenerating quite frequently 94miles typicaly250-300miles.
The second O2 sensor at 100% indicates a regen is under progress. 600 degrees is also on the low side.
The error code is pressure based. My next step would be to run a trial (warm engine) noting these parametrs.

Ducato - Tutorial to Measure specific Engine PIDs (Parameter ID) and Save data for analysis.

This thread is for the general discussion of the Guide Tutorial to Measure specific Engine PIDs (Parameter ID) and Save data for analysis.. Please add to the discussion here. theoneandonly submitted a new guide: Tutorial to Measure specific Engine PIDs (Parameter ID) and Save data for...

www.fiatforum.com

I would be happy to look at the csv files (attach to a post or PM or email )
If you are handy with a DVM back probe the connectors for the MAF and MAP sensors. to check applied voltage is a solid 5V and a sensible signal. If removed the amount of gunging up can be assessed. I believe the sensor is more fancy than typicaly fitted so may not put upwith a simple squirt with carb cleaner. The AIr flow measured to demand ratio is important. from my results the are not always perfectly in sync so simple single results wont tel you the whole story.I have had an example run run the values have been 25% of demand (i also know of at least one other member who has seen the same) This may be related to an old ducato problem where serveral items are on one fuse in this case fuse 51 and a reverse light issue could create MAF issues.
F51 5 Climate control, power steering control unit, reverse lights, diesel filter
water sensor, flow meter, tachograph (+key).

 

[kangexpress]

I would also recommend not to do a forced regeneration.
I think I've destroyed my DPF exactly that way.
Take off the DPF and LPEGR Cooler and
let them both cleaned professionally.

 

[theoneandonly]

Further to the post by @kangexpress on another thread i suggest you add
LPEGR Temperature to the list of parameters to record.

 

[Jamesbil]

Further to the post by @kangexpress on another thread i suggest you add
LPEGR Temperature to the list of parameters to record.

Sent you a DM

 

[Jamesbil]

If you are handy with a DVM back probe the connectors for the MAF and MAP sensors

Any more tips for doing this? I can do the voltage but what setting for a sensible signal? Ohms? And what values should I see? The back of the MAF sensor seems to be sealed round each wire. Also where is the MAP sensor?

 

[theoneandonly]

Any more tips for doing this? I can do the voltage but what setting for a sensible signal? Ohms? And what values should I see? The back of the MAF sensor seems to be sealed round each wire. Also where is the MAP sensor?

Backprobing a simple youtube



another for egr air input cleaning
Map sensor
at front of engine in centre just behind radiator

Technical - Ducato MAP sensor 2.3 Euro 6 X290. What is the process to reach it to remove it?

With various Fault codes showing Ive ordered a new MAP sensor as part of my things to change. I can see the top of the connector plug underneath the throttle body. The question is how to reach it. Can I remove the throttle body from the top to enable access to the MAP or do I have to remove all...

www.fiatforum.com

 

[Jamesbil]

Great thanks! That MAP sensor looks tricky!
So I got 2 cans of diesel purge and went to do it when I realised if I put the filter to engine pipe in the purge bottle, the lift pump will just pump fuel out the disconnected filter pipe.
How would you do it? Just connect a hose to it and let it into a jerry can?

I also got a spray can of DPF cleaner. Supposed to spray it in through the Lambda? sensor. Or could it go in the Differential pressure sensor pipe?
Says to do a regen after but I don't really want to. So just drive it?

Thanks for all the advice.