Technical 500f car and late 126 engine
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Technical 500f car and late 126 engine
smart51
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What do you mean by distributorless? Points but no distributor and wasted spark, or electronic ignition? The first one is simple. Rather than having a single HT lead from the coil to the distributor, and two from there to the spark plugs, you just have two from the coil to the spark plugs and a blanking plate instead of a distributor.
smart51
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No, I've never done that.
If you trawl through posts by @Vitesse, at some point Tony fitted one of those setups, or had an engine that came with one. He was an electrician and therefore seemed to have a good understanding of what it entailed. Sadly, Tony died a few years ago, but if you can find and revive a thread on the subject perhaps someone else will contribute. 
The 650cc 126 engines with an electronic ignition module were produced only in Poland for the 126p as far as I remember. The first ones were very problematic, the modules were of poor quality.
There's a description on how to retrofit the electronic ignition module to the previous version:
rezerwa126p.pl
Use the browser translation to get the text in English.
There's a description on how to retrofit the electronic ignition module to the previous version:
Opis elektronicznego układu zapłonowego i jego montaż w wersji ST / FL
Visit the post for more.
rezerwa126p.pl
Use the browser translation to get the text in English.
the hobbler
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Fiat fitted the Nannoplex ignition system to the EL and ELX versions of the (air-cooled) Fiat 126. On the the ELX engine variant, whilst the actual distributor fitment casting was still on the side of the crankcase, it wasn't machined to accept a distributor. If you would like to contact me direct--- ([email protected] ) I will put you in contact with a friend of mine who has fitted a lot of these systems. Whilst I will be using one of these systems on the '695SS' engine that I am (slowly) building up, it is in pieces at the moment so doesn't show the fitment of the wiring very well. My friend will be able to help you much more than I can, and has actually produced a booklet showing the system, and the wiring required.The 650cc 126 engines with an electronic ignition module were produced only in Poland for the 126p as far as I remember. The first ones were very problematic, the modules were of poor quality.
There's a description on how to retrofit the electronic ignition module to the previous version:
Opis elektronicznego układu zapłonowego i jego montaż w wersji ST / FL
Visit the post for more.
Use the browser translation to get the text in English.
EL was the marking for the electronic ignition model (1994-1996). The same ignition was used in the Cinquecento produced in the same factory. The engine had a code 126A1.076/9. In December 1996 they added the catalytic converter to meet the EUR1 norm. And they renamed the model to the ELX. The code of the engine changed to 126A1.076/K. As far as I remember, the engine model is stamped somewhere on the engine block. Probably by the engine number.
As the plant in Bielsko-Biała in southern Poland was the only one to produce the car, they dropped the p marking in the model name (it was added in the beginning of production in the 70's to differentiate the models produced by the Polish factories under the license and then independently). Most known FIATs produced in Poland were the 125 and 126, but I saw 127, and at least one of the 130/131/132 models. Not sure about the 128.
What I've linked in my previous post is a tutorial how to retrofit the Nanoplex ignition to the earlier engines. According to the tutorial there were 4 types of the ignition, which differred by the cut-out. The grey 210 and black 211 had the cut-out set to 6500 rpm, the blue 213A to 7500 rpm and the red one had no cut-out.
The tutorial doesn't mention it, but I assume the hole after the old ignition system should be covered. The tutorial doesn't list the exact engines types the electronic ignition can be retrofitted to. It only says 'older' models. Besides those the linked tutorial is precise, explaining the wiring and parts that need to be swapped and installation process.
That's how the whole set of the Nanoplex ignition looks like:
As the plant in Bielsko-Biała in southern Poland was the only one to produce the car, they dropped the p marking in the model name (it was added in the beginning of production in the 70's to differentiate the models produced by the Polish factories under the license and then independently). Most known FIATs produced in Poland were the 125 and 126, but I saw 127, and at least one of the 130/131/132 models. Not sure about the 128.
What I've linked in my previous post is a tutorial how to retrofit the Nanoplex ignition to the earlier engines. According to the tutorial there were 4 types of the ignition, which differred by the cut-out. The grey 210 and black 211 had the cut-out set to 6500 rpm, the blue 213A to 7500 rpm and the red one had no cut-out.
The tutorial doesn't mention it, but I assume the hole after the old ignition system should be covered. The tutorial doesn't list the exact engines types the electronic ignition can be retrofitted to. It only says 'older' models. Besides those the linked tutorial is precise, explaining the wiring and parts that need to be swapped and installation process.
That's how the whole set of the Nanoplex ignition looks like:
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the hobbler
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Marcodal:---when you come to fit the Nannoplex ignition system, make sure that you have the crank-shaft pulley witjh 3 lugs on the reverse side---these are ignition pick-ups and are essential!
There are two of them depending on the ignition module type (and colour):
46577004 for the grey and black and 46577369 for the blue and red.
the hobbler
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The problem these days is getting the specific pulley----generally speaking, there is only one 'generic'pulley on the market. If you get a complete kit (as I was able to from a guy stripping an ELX) than you should have 'matching parts'.
There is no generic pulley, the ignition timing is different, so each pulley is adapted to a different ignition module, as stated before and on the tutorial.
I'm not a mechanic, but I assume you can't install a wrong one, as it won't make the spark in the right moment.
There are a couple of shops that claim to have both of them, if someone needs one, let me know
the hobbler
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Thank you for that information "Green vanper": you are lucky enough to live in Poland where they made the 126 models, and so lots of parts are still available "off the shelf". For the rest of us poor mortals, we have to rely (mainly) on parts we, or our supplier, can obtain from Italy. I have tried to get parts from Poland, and in just about ALL cases they would NOT post to the UK. I have a colleague who fits a lot of Nannoplex ignition systems---he would be most interested to be able to obtain both types of the pulleys. Would you be so kind as to contact me direct [email protected] so that I can pass your details on to my colleague, and him then contact you. ThankyouThere is no generic pulley, the ignition timing is different, so each pulley is adapted to a different ignition module, as stated before and on the tutorial.
I'm not a mechanic, but I assume you can't install a wrong one, as it won't make the spark in the right moment.
There are a couple of shops that claim to have both of them, if someone needs one, let me know
Hi Marco
I have exactly this setup. '66 F with a Polish 126p 650cc engine in it. The (distributor-less) engine came to me with no electronics, except for the crankshaft position sensor.
After a bit of troubleshooting, trial and error, it has been running great this summer. It's especially enjoyed the cold sunny mornings of recent!
I got an APE 20FF ignition module, and the associated connectors, and made a loom to connect it. I referenced this post for the wiring.
https://www.fiatforum.com/threads/installing-electronik-ignition-kit.486992/post-4633981
I did not wire in a vacuum sensor, however. Maybe something I'll look into, having read this thread today!
The connectors to make the loom should be found on ebay:
In terms of wiring, I've been round the houses with ballasts and coils, and have settled with a more modern 12v coil, without the ballast, which seems to run great. You can't see much in the photos because it's all been wrapped, but to give you an idea, and placement of the various bits using existing mounting points. Naturally, the bits of flat bar I used to 'temporarily' mount them have not been quite so temporary!
I have exactly this setup. '66 F with a Polish 126p 650cc engine in it. The (distributor-less) engine came to me with no electronics, except for the crankshaft position sensor.
After a bit of troubleshooting, trial and error, it has been running great this summer. It's especially enjoyed the cold sunny mornings of recent!
I got an APE 20FF ignition module, and the associated connectors, and made a loom to connect it. I referenced this post for the wiring.
https://www.fiatforum.com/threads/installing-electronik-ignition-kit.486992/post-4633981
I did not wire in a vacuum sensor, however. Maybe something I'll look into, having read this thread today!
The connectors to make the loom should be found on ebay:
- Tyco AMP Junior 7 way - to connect to the ECU module
- Tyco AMP Junior connector 2-pin - to connect to the crank sensor
- Tyco AMP Superseal 2 way - to connect the coil (*modern type)
In terms of wiring, I've been round the houses with ballasts and coils, and have settled with a more modern 12v coil, without the ballast, which seems to run great. You can't see much in the photos because it's all been wrapped, but to give you an idea, and placement of the various bits using existing mounting points. Naturally, the bits of flat bar I used to 'temporarily' mount them have not been quite so temporary!
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the hobbler
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Thank you all who have given hints/tips/advise on this subject---much appreciated. However, could one of you kind folk please translate the parts identification in the drawing RYS 13-14; the lettering depicting what parts 1-10 actually are is very dim (or show it more clearly)---I am trying to"google translate", but the wording is not clear enough to decipher the Polish spelling .
The scan is crap, indeed.
I will rewrite it in Polish and will try to get the correct translation, but I'm not a mechanic nor a technical translator So, pardon my English
Rys. is short for rysunek = drawing (or diagram)
Schemat połączeń układu zapłonowego Nanoplex = Nanoplex ignition system diagram
1 - elektroniczne urzadzenie sterujące = electronic ignition module
2 - czujnik prędkości obrotowej i położenia wału korbowego silnika = engine speed and crankshaft position sensor (OK, that one comes from a translator)
3 - koło pasowe = flywheel
4 - czujnik podciśnienia = vacuum sensor
5 - cewka zapłonowa = ignition coil
6 - złącze diagnostyczne = diagnostic socket
7 - akumulator = battery
8 - wyłącznik zapłonu = ignition switch
9 - masa = ground
10 - świece zapłonowe = spark plugs
The wire colour coding is:
b - biały = white
c - czarny = black
f - fioletowy = violet
k - czerwony = red
n - niebieski = blue
p - pomarańczowy = orange
t - zielony = green
I will rewrite it in Polish and will try to get the correct translation, but I'm not a mechanic nor a technical translator
So, pardon my English Rys. is short for rysunek = drawing (or diagram)
Schemat połączeń układu zapłonowego Nanoplex = Nanoplex ignition system diagram
1 - elektroniczne urzadzenie sterujące = electronic ignition module
2 - czujnik prędkości obrotowej i położenia wału korbowego silnika = engine speed and crankshaft position sensor (OK, that one comes from a translator)
3 - koło pasowe = flywheel
4 - czujnik podciśnienia = vacuum sensor
5 - cewka zapłonowa = ignition coil
6 - złącze diagnostyczne = diagnostic socket
7 - akumulator = battery
8 - wyłącznik zapłonu = ignition switch
9 - masa = ground
10 - świece zapłonowe = spark plugs
The wire colour coding is:
b - biały = white
c - czarny = black
f - fioletowy = violet
k - czerwony = red
n - niebieski = blue
p - pomarańczowy = orange
t - zielony = green
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the hobbler
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Thank you so
Thank you so much for that---very much appreciatedThe scan is crap, indeed.
I will rewrite it in Polish and will try to get the correct translation, but I'm not a mechanic nor a technical translator
Rys. is short for rysunek = drawing
Schemat połączeń układu zapłonowego Nanoplex = Nanoplex ignition system diagram
1 - elektroniczne urzadzenie sterujące = electronic ignition module
2 - czujnik prędkości obrotowej i położenia wału korbowego silnika = engine speed and crankshaft position sensor (OK, that one comes from a translator)
3 - koło pasowe = flywheel
4 - czujnik podciśnienia = vacuum sensor
5 - cewka zapłonowa = ignition coil
6 - złącze diagnostyczne = diagnostic socket
7 - akumulator = battery
8 - wyłącznik zapłonu = ignition switch
9 - masa = ground
10 - świece zapłonowe = spark plugs
The wire colour coding is:
b - biały = white
c - czarny = black
f - fioletowy = violet
k - czerwony = red
n - niebieski = blue
p - pomarańczowy = orange
t - zielony = green
the hobbler
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A request for "The Green Vamper" please. I and a colleague are trying to use the 'Nannoplex' ignition sytems on engines that we are both building (mine will be a '695SS' engine)---the "Vacuum sensor" (czujnik podcisnienia) is proving just about impossible to find---can you help us with a supplier in Poland for this part, as well as the shops that can supply both types of Crankshaft pulleys. I can be contacted direct on [email protected] Thank you for help that you can give us (and other people)--very much appreciated. By the way, your English is first class---well done.
