Tuning 1.4 8v Seicento

[Ouby]

Yeah, Steve did far more than i'm capable of in getting the engine in & running but unfortunately the loom suffered quite a bit of damage in the conversion. Slowly finding the damaged sections & patching them up, so the performance/driveability is improving all the time. WAS hoping the last repair on Sat fixed the light issue, but it seems drowning the engine in water did the trick. Now i AM confused.

 

[ycming]

if you think the loom is damage why not remove the engine loom and go through it ?

 

[Eklipze3k]

if you think the loom is damage why not remove the engine loom and go through it ?

Or grab a complete loom from another Sei being scrapped and just change the whole lot over.

 

[Todger182]

I think the fault being cleared by dousing the engine in water was coincidental. I think you may have a fault with your ignition system. Starting from the basics might help find something.

All things aside though, you are trying to run an Engine with a stock ECU designed for a 1.1 8v, so there will always be an issue with faul finding.

Another thing to consider is you want this to be a reliable daily? Why didn't you just buy a normal well looked after schumi? This isn't going to be reliable without chucking some pennies at it for an aftermarket ECU and full rolling road tuning.

Don't want to sound like a stiff in the dump though.

Thanks

X

 

[Ouby]

Another thing to consider is you want this to be a reliable daily? Why didn't you just buy a normal well looked after schumi? This isn't going to be reliable without chucking some pennies at it for an aftermarket ECU and full rolling road tuning.

Todger, no worries, it's a legitimate question. I WAS after a Shumi, then i saw this & suffered a bout of IBFS (Itchy Bidding Finger Syndrome). Banged in a bid £2-300 less than i thought it would go for....
& here i am.

It has been very reliable so far, just feel that it can be improved (without throwing wads of money at it) just need some guidance & information as to what MIGHT fit & what would be beneficial (i appreciate it will never be 100%). Breakers yard at w/end for suitably sized TB etc.
It's amazing what can be done with enough determination- i've seen Chalky :worship:


Peeps -the loom change has always been on the books, just a matter of when i can fit it in, & whether to fit Punto 1.2 loom (+ECU etc, etc). For now i will just have to keep patching whatever's found.

 

[cc1]

The MF59 M1 version ECUs to me have a sensitive nature and a poorly designed MAP.
The hardware is of poor quality also.

Fiat had to order a minimum batch of 1000+ ECUs?

After solving the hardware/software issue, And produced M2/M3 M? They were left with 1000+ M1 ECUs?

Lets get rid of them in the budget range cars. Hmmmm. Seicentos.

 

[Todger182]

I would start weighing up your options in regards to ECU's.

Personally I still wouldn't put a 1.2 ECU in either.

If your going as far as to replacing the loom then why not look into building you own ECU loom from the spare, and fit an aftermarket ECU.

I'm currently using an omex 600, but lots of people on here swear by megasquirts, and also have alot of info already on here on them. There are other brands, DTA, Emerald, MBE, Autronic, Motec. They aren't cheap compared to the Megasquirt however.

Seems like a waste to not keep your bid happy finger, happy .

Thanks

X

 

[fingers99]

For the sake of messing around trying to get a plastic inlet manifold altered what do you get? You might as well just get an alloy one welded up

Sort of. Issues are that it's much cheaper to faff around with resin than buy an AC/DC TIG.

I've not seen a 1.4 8v inlet mani. Chances are that much of it can be used with a suitable TB melded on.

The 1.1 or 1.2 8v will limit the choice of injectors greatly, as will the alloy P75 mani.

 

[Ouby]

Sort of. Issues are that it's much cheaper to faff around with resin than buy an AC/DC TIG.

I've not seen a 1.4 8v inlet mani. Chances are that much of it can be used with a suitable TB melded on.

The 1.1 or 1.2 8v will limit the choice of injectors greatly, as will the alloy P75 mani.

Is there a difference between 1.1 & 1.2 manifold, inj rail, & TB? Yup, i know that little, my workshop manual only seems to cover SPI.
Would be handy if you could drive over with a standard Sei, a 1.2 Punto, & a 1.4 Grande Punto that way i could see what's common/different .

Sure i read Steve tried the 1.4 injectors out so would he have used a different fuel rail?

 

[cc1]

The 1.1/1.2 CF3 8v MPI inlet manifolds are the same. Punto grande/Brava/o? 1.2/1.4 8v look to be the same but use fly by wire TB.
1.2/1.4 16v have different stud pattern.

To date, There are no standard Fiat ECUs that will run a 1.4 8v unless you go fly by wire. The same goes for the 1.4 16v also.

You could use an old un-coded IAW 18FD 1.2 16v ECU if you could match all the sensors/injectors, But then the map still might not be right.

I have looked at the 1.4 8v for mine and have accepted that after market ECUs are the only way, Unless you have access to the electronic schematics and the facilities/knowledge to re-map.

Injection systems are designed/built specifically for the car model intended to make component interchange harder/impossible without major mods. (system/component specific). This allows manufactures to control spares/repairs.
Why do we have so many ECU variants when they all do the same job?

If you can manipulate an ECU, Then it will run any engine. Hence, After market.

 

[ycming]

I have looked into this in the past. And If i was gonig to do it would be.

1.4 8v block, with P75 head inlet and exhaust mani. Then just use the P75 ECU.

Ming

 

[cc1]

The punto 75 inlet mani will probably drop straight on the 1.4 head. finding one complete with injectors, fuel rail and TB is getting pretty hard these days.

 

[arc]

Got a feeling I have one sat in storage.. hmm

I really should have a clear out

 

[ycming]

The punto 75 inlet mani will probably drop straight on the 1.4 head. finding one complete with injectors, fuel rail and TB is getting pretty hard these days.

hmmm i thought the stud pattern would be different? If not the you are onto a winner:

 

[arc]

There is no reason for the stud pattern to be different.

 

[Ouby]

Got a feeling I have one sat in storage.. hmm

I really should have a clear out

Is this where i get really, really excited? :yum:
Umm, what have i got to tempt u with?
I think Fingers is after my roll-cage.... need any Mini bits? :devil:

So the ECU i need will be the IAW18F/8F Woj mentioned?
IF i remember right -
Can be virginised.
Doesn't use a cam sensor.
Requires one Lambda sensor.
Will it be for airbag model?

 

[fingers99]

Won't be for airbag. I'm not sure if that ECU can be chipped (and I'd expect you'd need more fuel) -- PM gazzaman2k re chip. Have some injectors that'll fit it.

The BUT is that if you can't re-chip the ECU then you may have problems getting the ancient type injectprs working ith an aftermarket ECU.

 

[woj]

8F/18F ECUs are chip-able, question is whether you can find somebody capable of that. I can always try to make you a chip for it, given the engine specs, and send it over, but that would be shooting in the dark, without a dyno and proper AFR logging it is a waste of effort and money.

But, as I said in an earlier post, there are people in PL that managed to run 1.4 8V with an un-chiped 18F ECU reasonably well. That is really less of a problem than making the 1.1 SPI ECU (16F) run the 1.2 75 engine that some people here reported is not a problem for them, though still hard to believe for me.

 

[Ouby]

and I'd expect you'd need more fuel

Meant to be fitted with 4.3bar pump/pressure regulator.
Marked as: 464 757 19 (0976 602 99 00). Been unable to identify it, maybe someone can tell me what it is.

Thought 2001 MPI were single feed (still waiting for MPI workshop manual).
This has 2 pipes (underbody clips for 3) one feeds fuel rail, other is plugged with a strange T-piece containing spring & ball mechanism!
Anyone any ideas on this?

 

[Todger182]

Had to explain this to pirus earlia too. 2 pipes, one for fuel, another for fuel tank vapours (charcaol canister).

Thanks

X