General Whoops, I've been a naughty boy. Anyone know about Speeding tickets?

[Most Easterly Pandas]

Hi all. Had a slight laps of concentration on 2nd Oct and got flashed by one of the 2003 red light / speed cams traveling at 37 MPH.

I have got a copy of the photo's taken, and have worked out my speed to be 34.7 MPH. Does anyone know if this is worth contesting, and if I've worked out my speed correctly?

I've calculated my speed using the secondary check line (the white lines at speed cameras) Which have been confirmed to be placed at 1meter appart at the site I was cought.


The following I found on the internet:

'Calculate distance travelled by multiplying the number of lines (between the two photo's) by the distance apart (e.g. 8 lines is 8 x 2m = 16 metres) and divide this by 0.6 (or 0.5, 0.7 etc., the time between the two photo's) to bring it to metres per second. Multiply the result by 60 to get to metres per minute. Multiply this by 0.0006214, the conversion factor to get to miles per minute. Finally multiply this by 60 to get to MPH.
Using the 16 metres figure, as in the example above, comes out at 59.654394 MPH.'

and using it and changing it to 1 Meter rather than 2 I got the following.

1. 9M / .58 = 15.517241379310344827586206896552 Meters per second
2. 15.517241379310344827586206896552 X 60 = 931.0344827586206896551724137931 Meters per min
3. 931.0344827586206896551724137931 X 0.0006214 = 0.57854482758620689655172413793103 Miles per min
4. 0.57854482758620689655172413793103 X 60 = 34.712689655172413793103448275862 MPH

Looking at the pic would everyone agree that I covered 9 meters? or 9.64meters which is what is covered if I were to have been doing the 37MPH.

Thanks all.

 

[T14086]

30 MPH 'max'......just pay fine & put it down to experience


(you could always say you were done for doing 93 in a 70 zone,makes the old panda look good)

 

[Most Easterly Pandas]

30 MPH 'max'......just pay fine & put it down to experience


(you could always say you were done for doing 93 in a 70 zone,makes the old panda look good)

LOL, and quite possible (just). I know I was speeding, but just want to see if I'm correct to prove that technology can be wrong!

 

[Plug]

Well, I agree with your maths. It looks like you'd covered 9m, assuming 1m increments, and 9m in 580mS works out at 34.7MPH, on my calculator at least.

Is it worth contesting? Hmm. It looks as though you *were* speeding, and by more than the 10% margin allegedly allowed for speedometer error. So even if you can prove the Cash Machine is incorrectly calibrated, you're still in the wrong. And let's assume you were doing 37.. if your speedo is anything like mine, 37 in real money (GPS) = mid forties on the speedo.

Yes, we hear of cases getting thrown out on technicalities, and tales of prosecutions being withdrawn if you ask for a calibration certificate for the camera in question.. it's really up to you if you feel lucky (or have a barrister as your best mate ). If you contest it and still get done, they'll just hit with a bigger fine to teach you a lesson..

Cheers,

Plug

 

[Most Easterly Pandas]

Well, I agree with your maths. It looks like you'd covered 9m, assuming 1m increments, and 9m in 580mS works out at 34.7MPH, on my calculator at least.

Is it worth contesting? Hmm. It looks as though you *were* speeding, and by more than the 10% margin allegedly allowed for speedometer error. So even if you can prove the Cash Machine is incorrectly calibrated, you're still in the wrong. And let's assume you were doing 37.. if your speedo is anything like mine, 37 in real money (GPS) = mid forties on the speedo.

Yes, we hear of cases getting thrown out on technicalities, and tales of prosecutions being withdrawn if you ask for a calibration certificate for the camera in question.. it's really up to you if you feel lucky (or have a barrister as your best mate ). If you contest it and still get done, they'll just hit with a bigger fine to teach you a lesson..

Cheers,

Plug

Cheers Plug. I was wondering what the GPS would have read. I remember as when the flash went off I glanced at the speedo and it read 35MPH. But there we go. I've since spent £200 in a 'GPS Mirror' Speed camera Locator and it tells you your speed and registers 70MPH when the car clocks 80MPH.

I wonder whether speed cameras are nearer GPS speed readouts of Car speedo readouts.

Think I'm going to take it as a learning curve, but thought I'd check the speed manualy because it might put me within the threashold to do a speed awareness course which would mean I wouldn't get the 3 points.

 

[Xen]

I compiled the following formula myself to verify the formula you found...

Use the following variables:
d = distance travelled (meters) = 9 (we are assuming 9 meters)
t = time between frames (ms) = 580

d/t*1000 = meters travelled in 1sec
d/t*1000*60 = meters travelled in 1min
d/t*1000*60*60 = meters travelled in 1hr
d/t*1000*60*60/1000 = speed in kmph
Simplified:
d/t*3600 = speed in kmph

We know that 1 kmph = 0.621371192 mph, so...

d/t*3600*0.621371192 = speed in mph
Simplified, the formula is:
d/t*2236.9362912 = speed in mph

where d=9 and t=580
speed in mph = 34.7

to me though, that pics looks like you were over 9 meters but under 10 so i tried with 9.5m...

where d=9.5 and t=580
speed in mph = 36.64 mph

Still a little out, so i rearranged the formula to figure out the distance the camera assumed you'd travelled...

s = speed in mph

d/t*2236.9362912 = s
d/t=s/2236.9362912
d=s/2236.9362912*t

d = 9.65m (where t=580 and s=37.2)

 

[Most Easterly Pandas]

Many thanks 'Xen'. Atleast I know I was using the right formula.

 

[Pandarus]

I always worked on the principle that they allowed you 10%

ie. 30mph - 33mph
40mph - 44mph etc.

You have been unlucky - just put it down to experience. I got a ticket for hitting an amber light on a road I did not know and although I did not agree I paid it.

MARTIN

 

[custard]

its a red light camera rather than a speed camera.
so you passed the line while it was at red and were speeding.

did you 'just' get a speeding ticket?
if so contesting it could get you another offence m'thinks

 

[drunfola]

do they still have to set a warning near the camera? n what do these cameras look like, im paranoid now lol

oh and do the markers have to be on the floor too?

 

[Plug]

its a red light camera rather than a speed camera.
so you passed the line while it was at red and were speeding.

did you 'just' get a speeding ticket?
if so contesting it could get you another offence m'thinks

If you look at the ticket it states "Violation: Speeding on Green" - and the lights are green in the first photo. Must be a combination traffic light/speed camera, I guess. We don't have any like that round here - they are either one or the other.

Cheers,

Plug

 

[T14086]

jeez give us your paypal account & i'll pay it for you!

 

[Most Easterly Pandas]

If you look at the ticket it states "Violation: Speeding on Green" - and the lights are green in the first photo. Must be a combination traffic light/speed camera, I guess. We don't have any like that round here - they are either one or the other.

Cheers,

Plug

Got there before me.

It was one of these that got me. They we introduced in 2003 and are fully digital. As soon as your flashed the pic is sent to a office through an ADSL line instantly! (I've done my homework, lol)


They catch you speeding on red or green, and do you for jumping the lights, so if your cought jumping the lights whalst speeding wave bye bye to your lisence! (the one in the pic isn't set up by lights by the look of it though, so that one does just speed.)

jeez give us your paypal account & i'll pay it for you!

I don't mind paying, its the points I don't like. If I can prove my speed was lower hopefully I can compleate a speed awareness course, which cost £105 but I won't get any points.

 

[T14086]

I don't mind paying, its the points I don't like. If I can prove my speed was lower hopefully I can compleate a speed awareness course, which cost £105 but I won't get any points.

Stay under 30mph next time...its that simple!

Think what the courts would be like if we questioned everything...you will end up paying in the long run.

 

[Pandarus]

I went to the Classic Car show at Ally Pally yesterday, on the way back I was overtaken by a Marbella which was doing 80-90mph!

Great show by the way, a handful of 500's, a 124 and a very nice looking 127 on the Fiat Motor Club GB stand which I was rather taken by.

 

[nitro_warrior]

How hard were you braking?

The camera works out your speed before taking the pictures (otherwise it would flash everyone) And that will be the speed on the ticket.

In both pictures you are braking and presumably slowing down.

After the flashes you checked your speed and it read 35mph. Given your speedometer reads 80mph when you are doing 70mph. This implies 35mph equates to an actual speed of about 31mph. You had probably slowed down a bit by the time the camera flashed and you checked your speed, so lets say the 2nd flash went when you were doing 32mph.

This suggests your first picture was taken with you travelling at 37mph and the second at 32mph so the average over the 9m will be about 34.5mph.

QED

 

[dannygp]

I know you can ask a police man for a calibration certificate for a speed gun. So maybe for this aswell. If you say your Panda, due to age/wear and tear etc your speedo is out by 3mph. Then show them your calculations. Could work

 

[Most Easterly Pandas]

How hard were you braking?

The camera works out your speed before taking the pictures (otherwise it would flash everyone) And that will be the speed on the ticket.

In both pictures you are braking and presumably slowing down.

After the flashes you checked your speed and it read 35mph. Given your speedometer reads 80mph when you are doing 70mph. This implies 35mph equates to an actual speed of about 31mph. You had probably slowed down a bit by the time the camera flashed and you checked your speed, so lets say the 2nd flash went when you were doing 32mph.

This suggests your first picture was taken with you travelling at 37mph and the second at 32mph so the average over the 9m will be about 34.5mph.

QED

I know that technically its suppost to read your average speed between the two pics. I was braking through both pics, but not to hard. It was the the bottom of a hill, and being auto dosen't have much engine breaking, so was just generally breaking.

I know you can ask a police man for a calibration certificate for a speed gun. So maybe for this aswell. If you say your Panda, due to age/wear and tear etc your speedo is out by 3mph. Then show them your calculations. Could work

I took the fine and points in the end. As a young driver I couldn't afford the 6 points I could have got if I appealed, it went to court, and lost. The car does over read by 10% even though it had only done about 17000miles at the time.

I would have fought it if I wasn't within the 2 years - 6 points and a ban zone on my lisence.

Apparently the camera 'calaberates itself automatically' daily because its digital, but I said thats rubbish because it can still miss read. At the end of the day the secondary check lines are there for confirmation, and they confirm otherwise in my favour.

I'd strongly recomend that anyone who gets a letter though the door gets the pictures and works it out manually! Surprising how wrong the cameras can be.

Jon.

 

[Most Easterly Pandas]

For Pete's sake, this is getting rediculos.

Now got a parking ticket dispite using the facilities and being told I wouldn't be issued with one. I now have to a letter of appeal.

I'm beginning to think that the Selecta dosen't like me. I was fine and didn't have anything like this with the 750L.

Pic quality is bad, due to a bad conversion, but you get the gist.

 

[JimMagill]

OH BUGGER!

That's a bit rough for parking at a leisure centre!

Jim