General US Abarth

[stevenwrichards]

Hi all,

Not sure if it's been discussed much on this forum but the US-spec Abarth 500 was released last week at the LA Auto Show. Have to say that I am rather excited about the car.

A few highlights...

• Requisite Abarth interior / body / chassis / brake / etc. mods
• 1.4 Liter Multiair Turbo rated at 160 hp (119 kw) and 170 lb/ft (230nm) in standard trim (as far as I can tell, it's the same motor as the APE, should include the GT1446 as well?)
• Standard Koni FSD (front only it looks like)
• Quicker steering ratio (15.5:1)
• Ability to turn ESC 'On' / 'Partial Off' / 'Full Off'

A few downsides...

• 2533 lb curb weight (most of the weight gain due to US front crash regs)
• 5-speed (C510) only (chassis mods make swapping for stronger 6-speed from APE impossible)
• No bi-xenon headlights
• Limited color choice (no Grigio Cmpovolo!?)

Overall, Americans can't really complain. Seems to be a pretty solid spec sheet.

The engine should be relatively easy to squeeze more power out of (APE SS mods, etc) but I am most worried about the weight gain (most of which is in the nose, just to make things worse) and the transmission. With the extra weight, it would be nice to have a bit more power but if the trans can't handle it then what are we to do...? I've read that the max input torque of the C510 is just 206nm... this car is producing upwards of 230 from the factory! Does this mean any additional mods will just fry the trans?

Quick bit from the press release on the C510:

"Designed to handle the increased torque loads, the Fiat 500 Abarth’s C510 transmission includes an intermediate shaft with equal-length half shafts to mitigate torque steer. Compared with the Fiat 500, the 500 Abarth features 23 percent larger half shafts (28.1 mm diameter vs. 22.8 mm diameter in the Fiat 500) for increased strength and to reduce torsional stress in the driveline during performance driving on the road or track. To handle the increased power and torque of the new 1.4-liter MultiAir Turbo engine, larger constant velocity (CV) joints with 53 percent greater torsional strength (2600 N•m vs. 1700 N•m in the Fiat 500) deliver added durability and refinement. "

1.4 liter Multiair Platform Manager also quoted saying:

"The 160-hp engine is already approaching the torque limits of the car’s manual transmission, as well as the power capabilities of the engine’s turbocharger."

Somebody just tell me that they are already running more than 230 nm through their C510 and I'll be happy...

Intro here: http://www.media.chrysler.com/newsrelease.do?id=11723&fIId=11724&mid=2

Full specs can be found here: http://www.media.chrysler.com/dcxms/assets/specs/12_Fiat500Abarth_Specs.pdf

 

[geeded]

The NA Abarth definitely has the 1446 Turbo so the engine can easily exceed 180hp. However, I can find nothing on the 5-speed transmission's maximum torque. Since the current max torque for the NA Abarth is already over the stated max for the 510 (that I have been able to find), it makes sense that the HD version used in the NA Abarth is rated higher since Fiat certainly doesn't want to start replacing transmissions under warranty. Especially since the USA warranty is considerably longer that the European one.

So, I can answer half your question. The transmission one is still hanging out there. I'd like to know myself.

Cheers

 

[loveshandbags]

The NA Abarth definitely has the 1446 Turbo so the engine can easily exceed 180hp. However, I can find nothing on the 5-speed transmission's maximum torque. Since the current max torque for the NA Abarth is already over the stated max for the 510 (that I have been able to find), it makes sense that the HD version used in the NA Abarth is rated higher since Fiat certainly doesn't want to start replacing transmissions under warranty. Especially since the USA warranty is considerably longer that the European one.

So, I can answer half your question. The transmission one is still hanging out there. I'd like to know myself.

Cheers

Thanks for the update on the use of the Garrett turbo in the NA A500. I wonder was the 4 year warranty a factor in the choice ? On an older thread it was discussed that the IHI was a better choice in the European A500 because of a faster spool up time and suited the 5 speed gearbox best. But the Garrett gives you better 'tuning' options if the gearbox can take it.

The torque ratings on the C510 gearbox is 206Nm. When I checked a previous post the URL didn't work but you could do a search on here for the official figures. The European A500 esseese model is producing 230Nm in Sport mode. Time will tell how they 'hold up' but I have seen no issues (except for one) of gearbox problems. I have experienced a whine in recent A500 testdrive that might have seen some track use.

 

[geeded]

Thanks for the update on the use of the Garrett turbo in the NA A500. I wonder was the 4 year warranty a factor in the choice ? On an older thread it was discussed that the IHI was a better choice in the European A500 because of a faster spool up time and suited the 5 speed gearbox best. But the Garrett gives you better 'tuning' options if the gearbox can take it.

I can think of two very good reasons that they went with the 1446 turbo.

1. The multi-air turbo (which uses the Garrett) is already in use with Alfa so most of the work, testing, etc has already been done. Simply detune so you don't blow the 5-speed and install in the NA Abarth.

2. The NA m/a turbo engine is already slated to be used as an option in larger vehicles here. The first (other than the A500) will be a Dodge Dart. Don't let the name throw you. It uses the NA version of the Guilietta chassis. This car will be able to use the full power engine, the Alfa 6-speed, and probably the new twin clutch auto since it will be much larger than the 500.

My guess is that point 1 just makes it easier to use in point 2. Also that it's cheaper to use one turbo across the board than stocking all the various parts for two systems.

Knowing my fellow Americans, I would expect a significant portion of the Abarths to be up to 180 hp in short order and too heck with the transmission.

Cheers

 

[geeded]

Sorry about the double post. My bad. Here is the "teaser" page for the Dodge Dart. Click on the 'slashed' pictures to expand. It is very clear about the engines (including a 2.4 multi-air as well as the 1.4 turbo multi-air), the Alfa connection, and three transmissions (doesn't elaborate on these - perhaps 6-speed manual, 6-speed torque auto, & 6-spd dual-clutch auto?).

http://www.dodge.com/en/dart/

http://www.fiat500usaforum.com/cont...-With-the-All-new-2013-Dodge-Dart-Compact-Car

Cheers

 

[Pinecone]

According to more recent info, the US A500 5 speed uses different internals than the non-Abarth model to handle the extra power.

It seems that the reason for the 5 speed only, is there is not enough room in the tranny to fit the larger internals needed and 6 gear sets.

 

[loveshandbags]

According to more recent info, the US A500 5 speed uses different internals than the non-Abarth model to handle the extra power.

It seems that the reason for the 5 speed only, is there is not enough room in the tranny to fit the larger internals needed and 6 gear sets.

AFAIK the C510 gearbox in the North American A500 is the same gearbox as in the European A500 with a 201 Nm rating (I incorrectly stated 206Nm on a previous post).

The M32 6 speed (GM sourced) that's in the AGP or the C635 (Fiat developed) 6 speed in the APE wouldn't fit in the European A500 unless IIRC the A/C comes out.
In relation to the 6 speed in the European F500 - this wouldn't fit in the US Fiat 500 because of additional crash protection.