Technical Sound when turning off

[Kaitlyn]

Hi,
I just had a brand new gearbox installed, have done less than 200kms since new gearbox/flywheel/clutch replaced and car is now making a little honking sound when I turn it off. Only when I turn it off. Seems like the engine cover? Local mechanic checked engine mounts and thinks is fine. He he isn't concerned by the sound, unless got worse.

The new gear box cost me 10k and the place that did it weren't very helpful and are over an hour drive away. So I want to get thoughts before I reach out to them

It's a fiat 500c, turbo twin air, 2014.

 

[Kaitlyn]

Thanks for the advice yes I wish I never replaced all of that in Jan, but at the time they had the car in pieces, so it was pay 2k to put a broken gear box back in, to then try and sell it ( which given how cooked the gearbox would) it would have been scrap.
I would have been happy if I got two years out of it after spending that much on repairs, not two months.

 

[Kaitlyn]

Sometimes its just better taking the loss on the chin. I've had two cars that were "cursed", I wish I'd got rid of them a lot earlier than I did because they cost me a fortune.

My guess is that you're in cursed territory now and something else expensive is going to happen to your car...Have you thought about loaning a car? You loan the car and have the option to buy later

After the money I just spent on it, all I'm financial set up for is to loan push bike

 

[AnthonyH]

After the money I just spent on it, all I'm financial set up for is to loan push bike

I don't know what to suggest, the car problem will pass through sooner or later, remember to stay smiling, maybe someone else on here can give you some ideas what to do.

 

[Kaitlyn]

That invoice is useful; thanks for posting it.


Question is, was this car originally fitted with a DMF or a SMF? Perhaps some of the other Australian TA owners may be able to shed light on what was fitted to cars in that market in 2014.

IIRC if it's an 85HP 2014 car it may only ever have had a solid flywheel.


A dmf is a specific type of flywheel which was fitted to all later TA's, and some earlier ones, including all 4x4's and 105HP cars. Its purpose is to smooth out the power delivery between the engine and transmission, and to reduce the wear and tear on the gearbox. They're known to make this kind of noise when they fail, which isn't exactly unusual. They also cost a lot more than the AUD 450 that you were charged for your new flywheel.

But you weren't supplied with a DMF; what was fitted to your car was a single mass one.

I think a 2014 85HP TA car might never have had a DMF originally; but unless your garage kept the parts, it might be hard to check this.

However, whatever it was originally fitted with, what they've fitted and invoiced you for is part 55225428, and that's a single mass flywheel.

If the car was one of the ones that originally left the factory with a solid flywheel, it would explain why the gearbox failed prematurely - dmf's were fitted to later cars at least in part to mitigate against this sort of fault. TA owners with DMF's facing the substantial additional cost of replacement at clutch change time can at least be grateful that it may have saved them from the cost of a gearbox rebuild.

But unfortunately none of this is helping us get any closer to working out what's causing the noise. Unless the original was a dmf and they've replaced it with a solid one, though somehow I doubt that; premature gearbox failure points to a solid flywheel.

I'll bet money that whatever the cause of the noise, it'll be something they did when they replaced your transmission.

So this is a picture of my old gearbox/parts they sent me once it was out of my car.

So essentially in the event it had a DMF initially it should have had a new DMF put back in ( not a solid) when they replaced it alongside the gearbox/clutch. So it's a stuff up on there end?

 

[Kaitlyn]

So this is a picture of my old gearbox/parts they sent me once it was out of my car.

So essentially in the event it had a DMF initially it should have had a new DMF put back in ( not a solid) when they replaced it alongside the gearbox/clutch. So it's a stuff up on there end?

And so it's basically drove < 200km of flat road since three parts where placed end of Feb.

When I get the local mechanic to look at it Wednesday , under the hope he can diagnose the case of the sound so I'm not having to go all the way back to launceston for that. Is there anything specific I should let him know/ask to check?

 

[AnthonyH]

What did the local mechanic say?

 

[Kaitlyn]

What did the local mechanic say?

Not concerned about fly wheel. Couldn't localise the sound. Engine mounts vibrate and could do with a replace but not urgent, but not goose honk. Advice was just keep driving it, if gets worse to then go to launceston to the fiat arsehole.

 

[Greasytrucker]

Not concerned about fly wheel. Couldn't localise the sound. Engine mounts vibrate and could do with a replace but not urgent, but not goose honk. Advice was just keep driving it, if gets worse to then go to launceston to the fiat arsehole.

Do you think the reason it’s making the noise is because the DMF has been replaced with solid? I know VW’s are always louder when you do the conversion on them but it’s a trade off for reliability. If it’s running fine and not got any louder since driving after replacement maybe you’ve just got to learn to live with it

 

[steveras57]

Do you think the reason it’s making the noise is because the DMF has been replaced with solid? I know VW’s are always louder when you do the conversion on them but it’s a trade off for reliability. If it’s running fine and not got any louder since driving after replacement maybe you’ve just got to learn to live with it

Guess then the point would be that the arseholes didnt tell you what they had done! that and the effects it might have ?-along with questionable charging and billing practices! cant you take em to court to try to get some money back? if the cars is gonna break in the future at the first signs you could always take it back to them and park it at 30mph into there showroom /building window( along with arranging to have a local news/television crew there to film the whole episode and give you an interview so you could "express" your views on the companys ethics and principles(or lack of them!) sure you might get arrested!- but if you was to go to the doctors a number of times before doing it complaining of headaches and stress so its on record that you are having mental issues with it then you could plead mental distress and get off with a caution!.

 

[jrkitching]

Do you think the reason it’s making the noise is because the DMF has been replaced with solid?

We don;t know that the car ever had a DMF - early 85HP TA's left the factory with a solid flywheel.

but it’s a trade off for reliability

You're basically trading the reliability of the clutch for the reliability of the gearbox. Replacing a dmf with a solid flywheel is generally a bad idea (dmf's are cheaper than gearboxes), but in this case, we don't know that the car didn't have a solid flywheel to start with.

along with questionable charging and billing practices

What's questionable about it? They've supplied an itemised bill, and they've fitted the parts they've itemised. If the car originally had a solid flywheel, and they've replaced it with another solid flywheel, that's not fraudulent.

I'd agree their charges are on the high side by UK standards, and I've already questioned the wisdom of spending this sort of money on a car of this age, but I can't see what they could have done differently in the circumstances. It's not their fault if their supplier supplied the wrong gearbox, though I'd question the wisdom of starting a job of this magnitude without first being sure that you've got the correct parts.

 

[Kaitlyn]

Do you think the reason it’s making the noise is because the DMF has been replaced with solid? I know VW’s are always louder when you do the conversion on them but it’s a trade off for reliability. If it’s running fine and not got any louder since driving after replacement maybe you’ve just got to learn to live with it

So the car is actually running so quiet and fine after having the clutch/gearbox/flywheel has all been replaced. It's literally just that random goose honk once I turn off engine that has literally just started about 2 weeks ago, with all that work having just been done less then 2 months ago.

So my current solution will be to plug my ears as I turn the engine off

 

[jrkitching]

It's literally just that random goose honk once I turn off engine that has literally just started about 2 weeks ago, with all that work having just been done less then 2 months ago.

It's not all that surprising that removing and replacing all the components necessary to carry out this work would have introduced the odd squeak and rattle.

Local mechanic checked engine mounts and thinks is fine. He he isn't concerned by the sound, unless got worse.

I'd be reassured by this.

And you have whatever warranty came with the job to fall back on if it does get any worse over the coming months.

All this talk of DMF's may just be a red herring as your car may well never have even had one.

I'd regard the car as fixed unless anything changes, and relax with the thought that the transmission at least should now outlast the rest of the car.

 

[Kaitlyn]

It's not all that surprising that removing and replacing all the components necessary to carry out this work would have introduced the odd squeak and rattle.

I'd be reassured by this.

And you have whatever warranty came with the job to fall back on if it does get any worse over the coming months.

All this talk of DMF's may just be a red herring as your car may well never have even had one.

I'd regard the car as fixed unless anything changes, and relax with the thought that the transmission at least should now outlast the rest of the car.

Thanks for advice that's going to be the plan!

I literally laughed out loud at last paragraph. If only I found this forum before purchasing the fiat, I would have avoided it completely . Its just so damm cute though

 

[steveras57]

We don;t know that the car ever had a DMF - early 85HP TA's left the factory with a solid flywheel.


You're basically trading the reliability of the clutch for the reliability of the gearbox. Replacing a dmf with a solid flywheel is generally a bad idea (dmf's are cheaper than gearboxes), but in this case, we don't know that the car didn't have a solid flywheel to start with.


What's questionable about it? They've supplied an itemised bill, and they've fitted the parts they've itemised. If the car originally had a solid flywheel, and they've replaced it with another solid flywheel, that's not fraudulent.

I'd agree their charges are on the high side by UK standards, and I've already questioned the wisdom of spending this sort of money on a car of this age, but I can't see what they could have done differently in the circumstances. It's not their fault if their supplier supplied the wrong gearbox, though I'd question the wisdom of starting a job of this magnitude without first being sure that you've got the correct parts.

maybe i should have said its there competence thats questionable then!

 

[Greasytrucker]

You're basically trading the reliability of the clutch for the reliability of the gearbox. Replacing a dmf with a solid flywheel is generally a bad idea (dmf's are cheaper than gearboxes), but in this case, we don't know that the car didn't have a solid flywheel to start with.

Whole new debate that only really. You’ll find as many people for as against replacing a DMF for a solid. I’ve never had a gearbox get damaged by doing it. Normally just an increase in noise

 

[vexorg]

Whole new debate that only really.

All because they cant make a decent gearbox these days

 

[samanthsen]

Sometimes its just better taking the loss on the chin. I've had two cars that were "cursed", I wish I'd got rid of them a lot earlier than I did because they cost me a fortune.

My guess is that you're in cursed territory now and something else expensive is going to happen to your car...Have you thought about loaning a car? You loan the car and have the option to buy later.

Have you considered that your car might just be one of those "cursed" ones that ends up costing more than it's worth to keep? I've had a couple like that and wish I had gotten rid of them sooner to avoid the financial drain. Have you thought about loaning a car with the option to buy later, as a way to avoid more unexpected expenses?

 

[varesecrazy]

Have you thought about loaning a car with the option to buy later, as a way to avoid more unexpected expenses?

In the UK, that isn't cost effective