General 500 top mounts & suspension

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General 500 top mounts & suspension

Been trying all morning with my partner & still no joy
No matter what we do the top keeps moving tried holding from underneath
Tried mole grips though the lack of shaft makes grabbing very hard

Those nuts are rusted into place

Even tried a breaker bar no play!
I think this is gonna have to be a garage job ? 6D11ADCC-DD88-4989-85BE-EB2A76855DA9.jpgView attachment 1
 

You can see here what mine looked like you can also see where I snapped the drill having to drill it again in another position, once you've drilled a 3mm hole it's not hard to split with a sharp chisel? You can also see just how clean the threads are?
 

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Been trying all morning with my partner & still no joy
No matter what we do the top keeps moving tried holding from underneath
Tried mole grips though the lack of shaft makes grabbing very hard

Those nuts are rusted into place

Even tried a breaker bar no play!
I think this is gonna have to be a garage job ?View attachment 211662View attachment 1
Where are you placing the grips on the nut on top
Or on the shocker shaft in the wheel arch area
 
I nipped up to wilko and they blow torched em for 10£! Trouble is now I’m back and working on car I now can’t undo the nut that holds the rod in place!! It’s not rusty but will not move without spinning

Again I’ve tried the Allen but still no joy

I don’t usually give up but since the chap at the garage said I’d have never removed the top mount bolts without a blow torch I’m gonna have to let the garage handle this!!

My partner isn’t much help he just gives up and without any help from anyone else I’m just going to had car over for all this to be done!
 
I nipped up to wilko and they blow torched em for 10£! Trouble is now I’m back and working on car I now can’t undo the nut that holds the rod in place!! It’s not rusty but will not move without spinning

Again I’ve tried the Allen but still no joy

I don’t usually give up but since the chap at the garage said I’d have never removed the top mount bolts without a blow torch I’m gonna have to let the garage handle this!!

My partner isn’t much help he just gives up and without any help from anyone else I’m just going to had car over for all this to be done!

Sounds like they may need to be removed with a impact gun then
 
Sounds like they may need to be removed with a impact gun then



I have one Chris but it just wouldn’t budge thing is obviously I have no clue who did what on this car prior the groves for the Allen looked like they had previously been stripped..... anyway at least I got the rear done I’m happy & sad at the same time

Car just gone in now for them to fit my new struts ect so hopefully be done in a couple of hours!
 
All done!! Wilko motosave installed my new front shocks both sides took them a couple of hours and charged me £50!!!!!!!

I’ll be going back to them in future if I get stuck!
 
Fair price (y) for something that you can spend hours with and get really frustrated :bang:

How's it driving now?



Smooth & bouncy ? I noticed the difference as soon as I changed the rear

I only went for the standard (original factory) kit that came from Germany
As it was quite confusing looking online and obviously I’m not up to speed on all the different kits!

How long do shocks last? And what tends to fail first?
 
I have one Chris but it just wouldn’t budge thing is obviously I have no clue who did what on this car prior the groves for the Allen looked like they had previously been stripped..... anyway at least I got the rear done I’m happy & sad at the same time

Car just gone in now for them to fit my new struts ect so hopefully be done in a couple of hours!
What is your air gun? Here are the two I own:

P1080510.JPG

The bottom one is a "reasonably priced" Clarke gun from Machine Mart. It works well enough on most wheel bolts etc but won't look at anything reasonably tight. The top one is a considerably more expensive Chicago Pneumatic which is all together a different beast - I've nick named it "The Hooligan" and it hasn't failed to shift anything I've tried it on yet - Hub nuts, Crank Pulley bolts, etc.

You may notice the Clarke gun (which I've owned for much longer than the CP) is fitted, in this picture, with a typical PCL connector and I ran it on a 1/4" bore hose. When I got the CP, only a few years ago, it came without a connector at all and, as I'd just bought my new compressor at that time, which was fitted with the larger bore "Euro" type connectors I invested in some larger bore hose (3/8") and some Euro connectors which I fitted to the CP and retrofitted to the Clarke gun. This lets it get considerably more air and has improved it's performance significantly but it still can't hold a candle to the CP. You may see the CP has an automatic oiler too? I have found over the years that tools fitted with these last much longer and the Clarke now has one too. If you don't fit one you must give it a squirt of oil down the connector before use each time. However using an oiler and PROPER AIRINE OIL has a hidden advantage. Airline oil helps counter the corrosive effects of moisture in the air supply and reduces internal rusting of the gun - or so it says on the stuff i bought.

I thought that, having bought the CP I would probably "retire" the Clarke but actually the two complement each other very well. The CP tackles all the stuff I know is going to be really tight but there's always the risk it'll just shear off smaller fittings so for these I use the Clarke so, far from going into retiral, the Clarke probably see more use than the CP.

So, I suppose what I'm saying is that air guns from the more budget orientated end of the market like my Clarke are, in my experience, rather limited in what you can expect of them and I'm not surprised to hear that, if yours is one of these, it wasn't up to tackling that strut nut.

So glad to hear you've got the job done though and that labour charge sounds very reasonable to me. Thanks also for keeping us up to speed with how things worked and that the car feels good.

How long might a shocker last? That's a "how long is a piece of string" type question. Probably the most common failure on shocks is that the fluid seal fails and they start to leak- immediate MOT failure of course. They can also wear internally so that the resistance becomes greatly reduced and the wheel can then bounce up and down uncontrolled, which can give the car some very strange and dangerous handling characteristics. (you can get some idea on this if you "bounce" each corner of the car up and down, by pushing on the wing (mind you don't dent it) I find I like to work it up to a good bounce by pressing down two or three times and then pushing down strongly on the last Bounce then standing back and observing. The car shouldn't really "bounce" at all. If it does that shocker is weak and needs changed. If you are in doubt about whether you are seeing "bounce" try comparing it with bouncing one of the other corners of the car. It's rare for all shockers to wear out at the same time. Rubber bushes top and bottom are common also, especially on the type where the spring is integral with the shocker and takes the car's weight, unlike ours where the road spring is separate. Then, less commonly, you can get a bent damper rod, serious corrosion (both of the barrel or mounting lugs), damaged or missing shroud (which protects the damper rod) - Can't thing what else! Predicting how long it might take for any of this to happen depends very much on what the damper is subjected to. When I worked in that wee country garage I've seen farmers vehicles which needed shocks done so often they should have taken shares in the companies making them! In more usual everyday use the sort of thing which is going to really kill them is going over speed bumps too fast. If you go fast enough to cause a significant compression of the shocker on every bump
 
What is your air gun? Here are the two I own:



View attachment 211698



The bottom one is a "reasonably priced" Clarke gun from Machine Mart. It works well enough on most wheel bolts etc but won't look at anything reasonably tight. The top one is a considerably more expensive Chicago Pneumatic which is all together a different beast - I've nick named it "The Hooligan" and it hasn't failed to shift anything I've tried it on yet - Hub nuts, Crank Pulley bolts, etc.



You may notice the Clarke gun (which I've owned for much longer than the CP) is fitted, in this picture, with a typical PCL connector and I ran it on a 1/4" bore hose. When I got the CP, only a few years ago, it came without a connector at all and, as I'd just bought my new compressor at that time, which was fitted with the larger bore "Euro" type connectors I invested in some larger bore hose (3/8") and some Euro connectors which I fitted to the CP and retrofitted to the Clarke gun. This lets it get considerably more air and has improved it's performance significantly but it still can't hold a candle to the CP. You may see the CP has an automatic oiler too? I have found over the years that tools fitted with these last much longer and the Clarke now has one too. If you don't fit one you must give it a squirt of oil down the connector before use each time. However using an oiler and PROPER AIRINE OIL has a hidden advantage. Airline oil helps counter the corrosive effects of moisture in the air supply and reduces internal rusting of the gun - or so it says on the stuff i bought.



I thought that, having bought the CP I would probably "retire" the Clarke but actually the two complement each other very well. The CP tackles all the stuff I know is going to be really tight but there's always the risk it'll just shear off smaller fittings so for these I use the Clarke so, far from going into retiral, the Clarke probably see more use than the CP.



So, I suppose what I'm saying is that air guns from the more budget orientated end of the market like my Clarke are, in my experience, rather limited in what you can expect of them and I'm not surprised to hear that, if yours is one of these, it wasn't up to tackling that strut nut.



So glad to hear you've got the job done though and that labour charge sounds very reasonable to me. Thanks also for keeping us up to speed with how things worked and that the car feels good.



How long might a shocker last? That's a "how long is a piece of string" type question. Probably the most common failure on shocks is that the fluid seal fails and they start to leak- immediate MOT failure of course. They can also wear internally so that the resistance becomes greatly reduced and the wheel can then bounce up and down uncontrolled, which can give the car some very strange and dangerous handling characteristics. (you can get some idea on this if you "bounce" each corner of the car up and down, by pushing on the wing (mind you don't dent it) I find I like to work it up to a good bounce by pressing down two or three times and then pushing down strongly on the last Bounce then standing back and observing. The car shouldn't really "bounce" at all. If it does that shocker is weak and needs changed. If you are in doubt about whether you are seeing "bounce" try comparing it with bouncing one of the other corners of the car. It's rare for all shockers to wear out at the same time. Rubber bushes top and bottom are common also, especially on the type where the spring is integral with the shocker and takes the car's weight, unlike ours where the road spring is separate. Then, less commonly, you can get a bent damper rod, serious corrosion (both of the barrel or mounting lugs), damaged or missing shroud (which protects the damper rod) - Can't thing what else! Predicting how long it might take for any of this to happen depends very much on what the damper is subjected to. When I worked in that wee country garage I've seen farmers vehicles which needed shocks done so often they should have taken shares in the companies making them! In more usual everyday use the sort of thing which is going to really kill them is going over speed bumps too fast. If you go fast enough to cause a significant compression of the shocker on every bump



Yeah my air gun is a billy basic! Probably why I was having issues!
Though I have to say I imagined a garage would say NO to fitting my own parts let alone only charging 50£ to do both front struts ect ...

If I had known before I would have just taken it in!
I do get great pride from doing my own work & doing a dam good job of it ..... but for that amount of work for 50£!! No brainer to me!

Just given the car a “bounce” very little movement she is handling like a dream and much MUCH better over our ****ty roads we have here in Leeds!
 
Yeah my air gun is a billy basic! Probably why I was having issues!
Though I have to say I imagined a garage would say NO to fitting my own parts let alone only charging 50£ to do both front struts ect ...

If I had known before I would have just taken it in!
I do get great pride from doing my own work & doing a dam good job of it ..... but for that amount of work for 50£!! No brainer to me!

Just given the car a “bounce” very little movement she is handling like a dream and much MUCH better over our ****ty roads we have here in Leeds!
As you say, for £50 that was really a no brainer unless, like me, your cars are your main hobby and every time I have to pay someone else to do work I feel like it's a major failure and "betrayal" of my vehicles! I'm just so "sad" aren't I?

Regarding the "bounce test" (and it was all light vehicles I worked on. Biggest stuff I touched professionally was the likes of maybe the BMC J4/Leyland Sherpa/Ford Transit/Bedford CF etc but mostly private cars though). I've seen cars with shockers so ineffectual that you could literally bounce the relevant wheel right off the ground! Very spectacular to see! The old BMC vehicles with Armstrong lever arm shockers - So the likes of A30/35, MG Midget/sprite, A55/60/Cambridge/Westminster, and others, were prone to it. I remember when people started taking their cars on the motorways back in the '60's, I was at college in London and I would travel back up to Scotland to see my parents and the future Mrs J, as often as funds permitted. Occasionally you would see an Austin Cambridge or similar, chugging along at 50 to 60 mph in the inside lane with it's front wheel bouncing right off the road surface with every revolution because it's tyre either hadn't been balanced or had poor balance and it's tired old lever arm shocker just couldn't control it. What the driving experience must have been like doesn't bear thinking about and the damage it must have wrought on the rest of the suspension too!

So, don't loose faith with doing your own repairs will you? When you've had a set back and something didn't go to plan or you break something it can be very disappointing and sets your confidence back, it does mine, but it's the experience gained in the trying that's valuable and trying more challenging tasks and so it goes on. Of course all this has to be approached with a constant eye on safety and if you feel you're unsure about something you've done probably best to get it checked out before driving very far on it. Maybe there will be other forum members in your area with "the knowledge" who might help with something like this?

All best wishes
Jock

PS what is the compressor spec which you are using to drive "Billy Basic"?
 
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