20vt engine in Alfa 145

[Anonymous]

Hi chaps

Like a few members on here I want to do a Fiat coupe engine swap.

I know it's not a Fiat, but I like the idea of surprising people with my little known car, like some of you HGT guys do

I am after some help because I am trying to figure out if the 20vt will fit.

From what I can gather, the 16v drops straight in to the 145 (same mounts) but the 20vt may or may not.

The 145 is tipo based like the Bravo and I read that the 20vt will go in a HGT but not other Bravos.

So what I need is to find out the difference between the HGT and non HGT models so that I can try and figure out if a 20vt is possible in my 145.

Can anyone let me know where problems would lie on the no HGT. Pics would also be cool?

 

[donnylad]

20vt goe in all bravos mate thats just a myth

 

[donnylad]

what engine have you got already?

LIVE FAST DIE YOUNG

 

[Paul R]

Right, i have owned a 146, basically the sme and i am pretty sure it will all bolt in much like the bravo, however you 'might' have more issues with wiring IF you dont have the entire car. I think you will also need a the subframe from the coupe, the 146 i had was only a little boxer so didnt have the same subframe as the ti's (ashuming thats what you have) so can not say for definate.

If you was to do it you really need a running coupe thats been rear ended, which is quite rare, seen a coupe go on ebay for 1k...

The hgts and the non hgts are differnt, they have different wishbones and shocks, but that doesnt affect the engine itself.

You likly to need to fabricat a new oil cooler system and intercooler, but thats not the end of the world.

Keep us posted, i like the sounds of this project, a bit different. you can email me direct if you want roughan (at) hotmail.co.uk, i know my way around a 20vt lump quite well and happy to help as and how i can

2xHLX owner,3xHGT, (then the darkside) 1xCoupe20vt now the proud owner of a Black Coupe20vt LE!

 

[grub2000]

Whoa, quick response guys. Ta

The current engine is a 2lt 16v Twinspark (155bhp).

The 20vt sounds promising then. I know that the 16vt engine mounts are in the same place as the 145 and that the 20vt mounts are in a diffenrent place. I guess this issue is resolved by using the 20vt subframe.

I was intending to buy a rear ended one if poss' I (it seems foolishly) assumed that there would be more 20vt engines about than 16vt.

A chap on the Alfa forums has just finished doing a 16vt swap and gave me a list of stuff that needs changing which included shocks, subframe, driveshafts etc..

 

[Paul R]

the mounts on the 16vt and 20vt are pretty much the same i believe. one on each chassis leg (one engine, one gearbox), one at the centre of the rear subframe and the stabiliser at the top.

If you get a pic of under you car i will tell you for definate.

well the 20vt engine isnt that easy to get as us coupe owners like to run silly power and blow them up an engine on its own is worth about 750-900 when you can get a runner for under 2000k it makes sense to buy the whole car running and brake the rest for parts to get money back.

Be careful though, lots of dogs out there.

Paul

2xHLX owner,3xHGT, (then the darkside) 1xCoupe20vt now the proud owner of a Black Coupe20vt LE!

 

[donnylad]

that is a right engine mate keep it and tune it up i luv them engines if only they had that 5pot growl lol i think to be honest they are the better engines get intouch with avanti motorsport pal they are the nuts when it comes to alfa's

calvert

LIVE FAST DIE YOUNG

 

[grub2000]

Yeah I am not denying that I do like the engine, but getting anywhere near 200bhp is going to cost £2k+.

They aren't very tuneable unfortunately that's why I was looking at the DIY engine swap.

 

[Paul R]

Pointless tuning a NA engine for the road, to get good power you need to make it undrivable, different if it was for a little race car but not a road car.

Better off getting an engine that fits and makes the power you want from the start. There is a 20vt engine making over 600bhp so once you have a 20vt the only limit on power really is you head and wallet.

Paul R

 

[grub2000]

600hp....bit much for a front wheel drive. Maybe if I was thinking 4WD as well but nice to know they are versatile.

I also meant to ask if you usually use the coupe ARB's and rear shocks?

Just wandered if you could buy coilovers for a coupe to fit on or if you'd have to buy coupe fronts and fiat (Alfa in my case) backs?

 

[Tom]

Go for the 16vt, its much lighter than the iron 5cly boat anchor.

Or better still put in the old all ally 8v t-spark engine, put some good cams in it, change the inlet manifold and get a drivable 200+BHP easy and a huge grin as it winds past 8k RPM

 

[donnylad]

they sound mint on carbs

LIVE FAST DIE YOUNG

 

[Ash]

hi grub im guessing you are talking about aj off the alfa forum. the 20vt will fit the 145 with the same parts change over list as the 16vt that aj gave you. personally if i were you the 16vt in the 145 would be my weapon of choice as the evo boys have developed it to death and back again. in terms of weight there isnt a lot in it between the 16vt and the 20vt i have had the dis pleasure of lifting both which isnt fun!


the main reason i like the 16vt in preference to the 20vt is that you can change the belts like you would a normal car unlike the 5pot where you have to suspend the engine off the mounts and fart around. also the electrics are a darn darn darn site easier!

final words
be warned if 20-25mpg bothers you then dont bother

Also dont listen to donnylad or he will try and convince you that you can reliably supercharge your na16v with his girlfriends hair dryer

 

[Tom]

ANY performance engine is gonna drink like it has a problem, unless you like driving a tractor

All ally engines are the biz though, its great when you can pick up the block with 2 fingers.

 

[Ash]

i have played with a couple i must admit they are nice. mr croft has a very nice book all about them too

 

[Roberto]

..."Also dont listen to donnylad or he will try and convince you that you can reliably supercharge your na16v with his girlfriends hair dryer"...

Rob
Mk.2 Marea Weekend 1.8 16v 115 ELX

 

[Anonymous]

Yeah it is AJ on the other forum thats done the swap.

I would have thought that the 8v engine would be even more rare than the coupe ones.

Changing the belts on a 20vt sounds like a pig, but the 6 speed box is very appealing. However, the wiring side of things sonds scary.

Has anyone got any links to a Bravo 20vt swap? surely there must be someone who has done a walk through?

 

[Tommy K]

The prob is..

People that have done the engine swops have given blood, sweat, more blood and tears doing the conversion & as a result, they are more than happy to offer advise when things get a bit tricky....


BUT


They will not happily give a step by step guide to how it's done, so everyone can do the conversion in their back yard.


I know it may sound a bit selfish & if we didn't share our knowledge/ experiences we might still be living in caves... but if your willing to sit down, work out wot you need to do and also put in the blood, sweat and tears then people will help you untill the cows come home

Tommy K - Have you got the Bottle!!

 

[Ash]

you can have a 6speed box on the 16vt if you can find one from a 20vt but even finding a 20vt with a 6speed box is hard going and tbh you dont really need a 6speed box it has no real advantages over the 5 speed.

 

[g5een]

is the 6speed box from the coupe same as the 6speed alfa's? if so you could fit a Q2 diff £250 from stealers pretty good price imo