Technical Victoria's Ill - 750L Running Issues

[Most Easterly Pandas]

Well, as some will know, Victoria (our 750L) wasn't at her best when at our meet Monday before last.

When warm and running she was ok, but at idle or cold things were a different matter.

The Sunday before the meet everything was ok, was the Monday morning, I put the starting issues which were not there down to a damp start. However on the way home we stopped in Norwich for a pub meal, and she refused to start - turned over but nothing.

Called breakdown out - but after 20 min of waiting, I spent a further 5 min trying her, and although rough at first, I eventually got her started - and cancelled the recovery and had yet another falling out with Swinton who provide the cover (another story).

Anyway, got her home, and I've not touched her since (oh the joys of a modern Fiat as a daily runner).

So went out tonight to change the HT leads as I suspect this is the issue. Before this I try here, misfiring again.

Changed the leads - Still the same.

As she warmed up she got better, but not 100%.

Stuck the plug tester caps on, and indicated a very weak spark on cylinder 4 when at idle after knocking the choke off.

Changed the plugs - still the same :bang:

Any idea's?

http://youtu.be/g2WWgCRwLvM

I'm thinking distributor cap, but that was changed in May about 1200 miles ago for a new one so am not too sure.

Any thoughts and ideas welcomed.

 

[dave]

did you put new rota arm in the dizzy cap too? in olden days if you didn't use a car for a while crap would grow on the contacts inside a dizzy cap too

 

[Most Easterly Pandas]

did you put new rota arm in the dizzy cap too? in olden days if you didn't use a car for a while crap would grow on the contacts inside a dizzy cap too

Rotor arm was changed originally, but broke when it overheated against the backing plate as it was pushed on to far, so original was put back on. Not changed it since, so will add that to my shopping list. It normal to cause issues with just 1 cylinder though

 

[Dragon Man]

i would say the dizzy cap. if you have changed everything after the dizzy cap then my guess would be that it is failing.

they are so cheap on ebay now i would buy 2 or 3.. i bought 3 so i have a backup. same goes for the rotor arm.

 

[Most Easterly Pandas]

i would say the dizzy cap. if you have changed everything after the dizzy cap then my guess would be that it is failing.

they are so cheap on ebay now i would buy 2 or 3.. i bought 3 so i have a backup. same goes for the rotor arm.

Yeah, think I remember seeing them for a silly price on eBay last time I looked, rather annoyed as rotor arm, dizzy, condenser and 4 plugs cost me £60-70 back in April when at a friends sorting her - a right rip off, but was a case of needs must

 

[VmanC]

I'd junk the lot Jon and fit an electronic ign. distributor from a 4x4.

As an aside, when you were doing your vid did you plug the vaccuum hose that would normally connect to the air filter housing?

 

[Most Easterly Pandas]

I'd junk the lot Jon and fit an electronic ign. distributor from a 4x4.

Electronic is the way I'm looking at going, although am trying to leave it for a year or two until she has her complete strip down and resto. Might do it sooner rather than later though.

Forgot to mention, point also changed with everything else, and setup by my friend who knows what he's doing with them (as I don't ).

As an aside, when you were doing your vid did you plug the vaccuum hose that would normally connect to the air filter housing?

No I hadn't I don't think.

 

[VmanC]

Electronic is the way I'm looking at going, although am trying to leave it for a year or two until she has her complete strip down and resto. Might do it sooner rather than later though.

Forgot to mention, point also changed with everything else, and setup by my friend who knows what he's doing with them (as I don't ).




No I hadn't I don't think.

Ah, as long as he set them with a dwell meter while the engine was running they should be ok.

If you run the engine without the air filter but don't plug that pipe it will run very week and lumpy regardless of what else is wrong with it.

If all the ignition side checks out ok and you still have the problem Jon, I'd do a compression check next. Yes it sounded like an engine with a misfire, but could also be low compression on one or more cyl.

 

[Most Easterly Pandas]

Yes it sounded like an engine with a misfire, but could also be low compression on one or more cyl.

I'm hoping not

Ouch of curiosity would something like head gasket failure etc get better as the engine warms up normally

 

[Dragon Man]

i have known it on small non forced air cooled 2 stroke engines running for long times.
the heat of it not moving and just ticking over caused it to expand and "plug" the gasket.

no idea if it would be the same on a liquid cooled engine maintained at lower temperatures.

 

[VmanC]

I'm hoping not

Ouch of curiosity would something like head gasket failure etc get better as the engine warms up normally

No not really.

 

[lightweightmick]

Well, as some will know, Victoria (our 750L) wasn't at her best when at our meet Monday before last.

When warm and running she was ok, but at idle or cold things were a different matter.

The Sunday before the meet everything was ok, was the Monday morning, I put the starting issues which were not there down to a damp start. However on the way home we stopped in Norwich for a pub meal, and she refused to start - turned over but nothing.

Called breakdown out - but after 20 min of waiting, I spent a further 5 min trying her, and although rough at first, I eventually got her started - and cancelled the recovery and had yet another falling out with Swinton who provide the cover (another story).

Anyway, got her home, and I've not touched her since (oh the joys of a modern Fiat as a daily runner).

So went out tonight to change the HT leads as I suspect this is the issue. Before this I try here, misfiring again.

Changed the leads - Still the same.

As she warmed up she got better, but not 100%.

Stuck the plug tester caps on, and indicated a very weak spark on cylinder 4 when at idle after knocking the choke off.

Changed the plugs - still the same :bang:

Any idea's?

http://youtu.be/g2WWgCRwLvM

I'm thinking distributor cap, but that was changed in May about 1200 miles ago for a new one so am not too sure.

Any thoughts and ideas welcomed.

Jon, you might have more than one problem here suggest you try anther fuel pump. It might not be delivering c
sufficient fuel at lower revs. A problem I've had in the past,
Cheers mick

 

[Most Easterly Pandas]

Jon, you might have more than one problem here suggest you try anther fuel pump. It might not be delivering c
sufficient fuel at lower revs. A problem I've had in the past,
Cheers mick

Cheers Mick, something I'll look into - think I've a few spare.

 

[lightweightmick]

You can check - if it's not starting - take air filter off and dribble a bit of petrol into the carb - if it fires you know you got a fuel supply problem. If it fires up and continues to run - fuel pump could be delivering insufficient fuel at low revs and when it starts and revs the fuel pump then kicks out some fuel.
I got to thinking from your vid that even on 3 with that weak no.4 it should still start on the other 3. It's always the intermitent problems that are the trickiest to sort though!
Hey, I'm 'tethering' to my mobile! That's a first for me... 21st century lightweight ! - but I only got 250mb and don't want a nasty shock when 1st bill comes...

 

[Most Easterly Pandas]

Hey, I'm 'tethering' to my mobile! That's a first for me... 21st century lightweight ! - but I only got 250mb and don't want a nasty shock when 1st bill comes...

2gb a month for me to tether my iPad to my phone when needed luckily

 

[Most Easterly Pandas]

Replacement dizzy and rotor arm seems to have practically resolved the issue. Just to wait and try another cold start again to see.

Occasionally coughing at speed (60-70), but seems to come across as more of a mixture issue rather than a misfire.

 

[Most Easterly Pandas]

Went to the gym, came out, started ok, got up the road and still playing up :bang:

Going to get it to my friends to play with, just got to find time now

 

[Dragon Man]

check your primary input of the coil mate, make sure them annoying spade connectors are really gripping on tight.
the ones on my sisley like to be "jiggled" every so often. i need to clean them up proper, and copper slip them.

hmm its interesting that it temporary fixed your problem..

is it still the problem on No.4 cyl?

 

[Most Easterly Pandas]

All sorted. My man that can spent 5 min tinkering with the points and all is now good again. Gap had closed for some reason.

:slayer:

Going to look at going electronic ignition though. Anyone know of any good kits? Money not an object if it's worth going top notch.

 

[VmanC]

All sorted. My man that can spent 5 min tinkering with the points and all is now good again. Gap had closed for some reason.

:slayer:

Going to look at going electronic ignition though. Anyone know of any good kits? Money not an object if it's worth going top notch.

The electronic ign. fitted to Pandas is as good as any.