Technical Stop Startbattery charging and charger

[Farrah]

Hi,

OK I have my new AGM stop start battery fitted and now wondering from what I am reading if I cooked the old one.

The car was new to us for our daughter and has sat around partly because we have too many other cars.

So the battery went flat and we just charged up with one of our CTEK chargers but it would not go past two lights. So we put on a standard battery charger each time to the battery terminals.

This too had no effect and assumed battery had just gone belly up.

Now exactly what is the best and only way to look after the battery as the car will likely get used little until this covid crisis is over and back to uni/schools.

So need to know best device to buy or are our CTEK conditioner chargers OK to use and exactly where to put the clips to charge ie direct onto battery or onto body bolt earth.

Once again any help appreciated


Farrah

 

[varesecrazy]

Hi,

OK I have my new AGM stop start battery

So the old attery went flat and we just charged up with one of our CTEK chargers but it would not go past two lights.

So need to know best device to buy or are our CTEK conditioner chargers OK to use and exactly where to put the clips to charge ie direct onto battery or onto body bolt earth.

Once again any help appreciated


Farrah

Have a look in panda 2012.. somebody had a thread running about this issue


Here you go:

https://www.fiatforum.com/panda-iii/480198-trickle-charger-2.html?p=4531779

Charlie

 

[Piccolo Nero e Bella]

I bought a CTEK MXS-5.0 a few weeks ago and it's been connected to my car battery ever since. It has a dedicated AGM setting but my Stop/Start battery is an EFB type. I originally bought a similar NOCO charger but had to return it after it proved faulty.

The battery was in excellent condition before attaching the charger so I haven't had cause to use the reconditioning feature. As I understand it, if the device doesn't go beyond the No.2 LED then the battery is beyond help.

I used the supplied permanent socket with the eyelets, connected to the battery's positive terminal and to a good earth point on the body - that way I can quickly pop the bonnet and connect the unit when required. Do not attach the negative lead directly to the negative terminal of the battery; as I understand it this can cook the Stop/Start system's own battery monitor. The optional extension lead means the charger is screwed to the garage wall and I don't have a mains cable running across the floor.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=84jg8spF7oU

 

[Farrah]

Hi,

Thanks for the info. OK I have read it all and bought a CTEK Stop/start C5 new for £65 from UK nautical supplier. There was one on ebay for £75 apparently bought in a 'job lot' or could make offer but used up my 3 offers at £70 and still automatically declined/refused so obviously not much point of putting make offer and I least I have certaintaty of a warranty buying from UK company.

Now all I need to know is where to connect the leads to. Do I connect the negative to the battery direct or to the negative earth bolt point on the body. The reason I ask is because there is some sort of start/stop sensor on the negative side of the battery terminal. Have not found anywhere that makes this clear..

Edit sorry was writing this same time as Picco so will look more at what is said here.

Yes my other Ctek chargers have about 7 lights and sometimes some batteries won't go above the first 2 and are useless other times the first light comes on red and then definitely battery is caput.

Saw the MX5 and was much cheaper but it did not say in the description it was or had a stop/start battery changeover switch...........

Thanks for the connection info I think now I definitely 'cooked' my previous battery.......hey you learn by mistakes



Farrah

 

[jrkitching]

Under no circumstances connect a charger directly across the battery terminals on a 500 with S/S fitted; you risk frying the electronics in the intelligent battery sensor (IBS).

Connect the positive lead to the positive battery terminal, and the negative lead either to the earth post on the other side of the IBS to the battery terminal or (better) to a secure earthing point on the chassis.

Fiat produced a supplement to the manual for S/S cars, and back in the day, some dealers also provided an A4 sheet detailing the procedure. They'd had so many cars back with damage caused by mischarging that they made all the customers sign a form at handover saying they'd read and understood the supplementary instructions.

See the attacments.

 

[Piccolo Nero e Bella]

On a final note of caution; beware 'customer service' representatives, even those from large and, presumably, reputable companies!

When the brand new NOCO charger I'd purchased constantly indicated 'less then 75% charge" after 24 hours on two separate batteries that I knew to be in good condition I contacted the US customer service and explained the circumstances and that I believed the unit to be faulty. In a somewhat patronizing message I was advised that;

"... However, in order to charge the battery with our chargers, both eyelets or clamps must be connected directly to the battery. For charging and maintaining, the negative cannot be connected to a ground like it would be for jump starting, it must be connected directly to the battery. If it isn't, this would cause the charger to not get a clear read on the battery."

This was also repeated by the AU-based seller of the device.:bang:

After I pointed out that I had indeed attached the charger to both terminals of the second battery (which is not in a vehicle) and that NOCO's own website says;

"2.) Connect the negative (black) battery clamp or eyelet terminal connector to the negative (NEG,N,-) battery terminal or vehicle chassis."

(my emphasis) they finally accepted that there was a fault with it.

 

[Farrah]

Hi,

Well whatever I screwed up it appears it was the battery that suffered.

I assume the IBS is the little black thing connected to the negative battery terminal and thankfully now with new battery the car is fine and SS working.

Thanks for the PDF files WHY not a warning sticker close by the battery.:bang:


I am glad at least I asked before risking another low battery due to no use.

Piccola I have a battery charger that has a mode switch 6v 12v 24v +TRICKLE setting I bought in Germany....good make but did not realise that after a power cut it goes into a default mode and I ended up cooking a 6v battery on a ride on lawn mower as it defaulted to 12v overnight when power was restored.

Worth just seeing what happens after a momentary power cut.

Customer services worldwide are like insurance companies deny deny deny liability......all depends how persistent someone wants to be.

That said I just bought some parts from PARTSWORLD a Fiat/Alfa parts supplier here in UK and they were excellent with their customer service backup.

Farrah

 

[Piccolo Nero e Bella]

Hi,

Worth just seeing what happens after a momentary power cut.

Customer services worldwide are like insurance companies deny deny deny liability......all depends how persistent someone wants to be.

Farrah

The CTEK restarts in the mode that was last set so there's no issue there. We had a couple of outages a few weeks ago when 'something' tripped our safety switch a couple of times (it wasn't the charger).

I think "Deny, deny, deny." is the first line in the customer service handbook. The FIAT dealer did exactly the same when I complained that my original battery was faulty from the day I bought the car. It was already ten months old and had obviously been in storage, uncharged, for most of that time. The S/S didn't work but they claimed it was my fault (short trips, phone charger etc.). It was only the knowledge I'd gained from this forum that gave me the confidence to push them till they fitted a new battery. Even then it was a non-S/S type!!!

 

[varesecrazy]

The handbook states 'FIAT service'
At every turn..
They know about the battery charging procedures : no labels required

Its only adding fluids..and visual checks were are 'empowered' to do..

In all seriousness..
Having read the above posts.. I was wondering how I never 'blew up' anything back when I worried about the Stop.Start on my twinair.. charged it one weekend a month (it did make a difference..)

What I did was remove the 2 terminal clamps.. Isolated them..
And charged the 'standalone' battery for @6 hours.. until my intelligent charger said Full

Let it stand for an hour.. then reconnect

All worked fine

That 2012 battery hasnt been 'topped up' in any sense other than driving in 4+ years.. was inactive for 6 weeks recently.. still doing its job

Not sure stop.start will ever 'activate' again.. but it will auto start after a stall

 

[Bizzun]

I bought a CTEK MXS-5.0 a few weeks ago and it's been connected to my car battery ever since. It has a dedicated AGM setting but my Stop/Start battery is an EFB type.

I believe my 2015 Fiat 500s 1.2 has the same EFB battery. Mine is the original Fiat/Mopar one with Part Number:- 51816427 printed on it. How can I determine whether this is an EFB type battery? Could it be an AGM type?

I used the supplied permanent socket with the eyelets, connected to the battery's positive terminal and to a good earth point on the body - that way I can quickly pop the bonnet and connect the unit when required.

I also have a Ctek charger which I use for another car and I'd like to attach a permanent Ctek socket to my battery (as I have a spare). How about the stud on the battery tray that holds the strap down? Wouldn't that be good enough?

 

[jrkitching]

Could it be an AGM type?

No.

51816427 is a EFB S/S battery.

 

[Piccolo Nero e Bella]

I also have a Ctek charger which I use for another car and I'd like to attach a permanent Ctek socket to my battery (as I have a spare). How about the stud on the battery tray that holds the strap down? Wouldn't that be good enough?

The cables on the socket are pretty short; no more than about 10"-12" on mine, so your choices are limited. I found an unused nut welded to the panel in front of the battery into which I was able to screw a retaining bolt to clamp the eyelet.

 

[Bizzun]

The cables on the socket are pretty short; no more than about 10"-12" on mine, so your choices are limited. I found an unused nut welded to the panel in front of the battery into which I was able to screw a retaining bolt to clamp the eyelet.

Yes! I found the nut you're referring to, looks to be M6. Thanks for the suggestion.

 

[varesecrazy]

That 2012 battery hasnt been 'topped up' in any sense other than driving in 4+ years.. was inactive for 6 weeks recently.. still doing its job

Well another year on.. and still the same

Car sits for weeks unused.. battery still seems good

Not bad for a 2012 build..

It just gets charged by the alternator when it does get driven ( we moved house 4 years ago.. the battery hasnt seen a charger since )

Our 169 panda got through 3 lead acid batteries in that timeframe

 

[Piccolo Nero e Bella]

Some batteries just don't know when to quit do they? Had one like that in a previous car.

 

[Piccolo Nero e Bella]

Yes! I found the nut you're referring to, looks to be M6. Thanks for the suggestion.

I didn't know what size the nut was, just hunted around in my spares box till I found a bolt which fitted.

I was able to tuck the socket under the battery strap (see the photo near the top of this thread) so it's not floating about, though it's not going to reach any moving parts.

One downside to the CTEK charger is that it interferes with telly reception in the room behind the wall it's mounted to!!