Technical Split charge relay

[Doobray]

Does anyone know where the split charge relay is located
Schaudt EBL 241
2019 Ducato 2.3
Malibu QB500

 

[HughJampton]

Conventionally, with an EBL all the required relays are mounted internally.

Any problem might not be the relay itself (for instance it might be loss of the D+ signal).

What's the issue.

 

[Doobray]

It's not a problem I need to fit a B2B so looking to disable it

 

[HughJampton]

Whilst much of the discussion here is about the EBL99, the principle(s) are the same.

Schaudt EBL99 - Disabling Charger Functions

Looking for a quick summary/check of the following from you Hymer/Adria EBL Geeks please :) Van with an EBL Unit (think EBL99 as it is a small 09 plate van) Fitting an Mains Charger; Trickle Charger and B2B, all of which will be external to the EBL unit What do I need to do remove all charging...

www.motorhomefun.co.uk

 

[Communicator]

I do not have a diagam for the EBL 241, but I do have one for the EBL240, which I expect to be similar.

On the EBL240, the starter battery is externally connected at the rear of the EBL, and internally only connects with the split charge relay contact.

Why not just disconnect the starter battery at the rear of the EBL, and at the relevant connection at the starter battery to make safe.?

 

[HughJampton]

Effectively, that's what pulling the (appropriate) 50A fuse, as detailed in the link I provided, does.

 

[Doobray]

I do not have a diagam for the EBL 241, but I do have one for the EBL240, which I expect to be similar.

On the EBL240, the starter battery is externally connected at the rear of the EBL, and internally only connects with the split charge relay contact.

Why not just disconnect the starter battery at the rear of the EBL, and at the relevant connection at the starter battery to make safe.?

Thanks was just worried it was feeding the fridge

 

[HughJampton]

I'm a bit wary of the above.

All the EBLs I've had a look at before feed the fridge via a separate (usually 20A) fused connection, which is detailed on the circuit diagrams. (generally labelled "+ starter battery for refrigerator").

For the EBL241 (manual here with circuit diagram at the end)

https://res.cloudinary.com/lci-cloudinary/image/upload/v1694803226/lippert-eu/support/power-on-board/pdf/anleitungen/911/9110513/8110513_2018-06-05_EBL_241_BA_EN.pdf

that separate connection doesn't "jump out at me". I may be misreading, but it does look to me as if the single (main) connection to the vehicle battery might drive the 'fridge as well on the EBL-241. It's worth a second check.

 

[Doobray]

Thanks it looks that way. Don't know if just fitting the B2B and leaving as is will cause any problems

 

[HughJampton]

I avoided any such issues by fitting a lower-powered Schaudt BtoB which simply jumps the existing rear connections, and allows the relays to be ignored (the power is delivered through them).

If wiring a BtoB separately, I don't think I'd be happy to leave the extra connection.

Thinking out of the box, do you have an AES or Compressor fridge? If so, I think inserting the fuse in the "AES fridge" position on the face of the EBL, if it isn't already would connect the fridge to the Leisure Battery, rather than the vehicle battery. (For a compressor fridge, this should always be the case. For an AES fridge, it allows the fridge AES logic to do the switching, rather than the internal EBL relay, but installed AES fridges aren't always configured that way from the factory, and they still work).

If that's the case (I'm still having a bit of difficulty with the EBL241 diagram, but it's the case on my EBL30), then doing that and pulling the 50A starter battery fuse might give you what you want. (FWIW, mine is AES and has the fuse inserted).

 

[MSjoberg]

that separate connection doesn't "jump out at me".

It's close to the bottom left corner of the diagram on page 13

 

[Doobray]

I avoided any such issues by fitting a lower-powered Schaudt BtoB which simply jumps the existing rear connections, and allows the relays to be ignored (the power is delivered through them).

If wiring a BtoB separately, I don't think I'd be happy to leave the extra connection.

Thinking out of the box, do you have an AES or Compressor fridge? If so, I think inserting the fuse in the "AES fridge" position on the face of the EBL, if it isn't already would connect the fridge to the Leisure Battery, rather than the vehicle battery. (For a compressor fridge, this should always be the case. For an AES fridge, it allows the fridge AES logic to do the switching, rather than the internal EBL relay, but installed AES fridges aren't always configured that way from the factory, and they still work).

If that's the case (I'm still having a bit of difficulty with the EBL241 diagram, but it's the case on my EBL30), then doing that and pulling the 50A starter battery fuse might give you what you want. (FWIW, mine is AES and has the fuse inserted).

I have just fitted the Victron 30A B2B leaving the split charge relay in circuit and it's putting in 34A.

 

[HughJampton]

It's close to the bottom left corner of the diagram on page 13

Not as far as I can see - what I've got there is the output(s) to the fridge.

What I think is missing is the extra 20A connection to the starter battery, as shown here for my EBL30.

 

[HughJampton]

I have just fitted the Victron 30A B2B leaving the split charge relay in circuit and it's putting in 34A.

You may be OK, (I'm not sure the BtoB might not get confused under certain circumstances) but as I say, if you have a compressor or AES fridge, and you already have or put the AES fridge fuse in place, then I'm pretty sure you can isolate the starter battery from the EBL (in the first instance to make it easy, by removing the (nominally) 50A fuse which should be near the starter battery). The fridge should then work off the leisure battery.

 

[Doobray]

Sounds like a plan thanks

 

[Communicator]

I'm a bit wary of the above.

All the EBLs I've had a look at before feed the fridge via a separate (usually 20A) fused connection, which is detailed on the circuit diagrams. (generally labelled "+ starter battery for refrigerator").

For the EBL241 (manual here with circuit diagram at the end)

https://res.cloudinary.com/lci-cloudinary/image/upload/v1694803226/lippert-eu/support/power-on-board/pdf/anleitungen/911/9110513/8110513_2018-06-05_EBL_241_BA_EN.pdf

that separate connection doesn't "jump out at me". I may be misreading, but it does look to me as if the single (main) connection to the vehicle battery might drive the 'fridge as well on the EBL-241. It's worth a second check.

I agree the EBL 240 diagram differs from the EBL 241 in that area.

On the EBL 241, one solution seems to be to disconnect the split charge relay coil at the PCB connections A1 & A2, but how can this be achieved in practice?

When faced with a similar problem with a CBE DS520 board, I opted to supply the fridge via a changeover relay connected at the B1 input point, and energised when the engine is running. It preserves mains charging of B1, and removed the potential load placed by the fridge on my small B2B.

A similar approach for the EBL 241 would need further consideration.