dont buy any car fitted with a DPF (diesel particulate filter)

[cushioncreeper]

Re: dont buy any fiat fitted with a DPF (diesel particulate filter)

I've spoken to a hyundia dealer about an I30 diesel, with a dpf, they tell me the dpf is gauranteed for a full 5 years, so why 2 years on a fiat ?

You may find that hyundai aren't as keen to honour their warranty as you are initially lead to believe.
The small print will probably guarantee the dpf for 5 years or X thousand miles? it may even have a rider covering 'misuse' in other words something like 'if the dpf should fail because the owner consistently does short journeys, hyundai will not be responsible for replacing...'
I would imagine they can tell instantly if the car's not had a good blowout & because you failed to read every page of the manual, you will be responsible.

 

[The Beard]

Re: dont buy any fiat fitted with a DPF (diesel particulate filter)

The question that's on my lips is: How do you know when the engine is warm enough? I'm afraid the motor industry and the EU come up with these ideas and really don't think them through.

One motor industry good idea that is at odds with the handbook is the heated front screen on Fords. The heater fan should be strong enough to demist the inside, so the only reason I can think of for having the Quickclear front screen is to de-ice it before you drive off. Yet the handbook advises that you should drive off as soon as you have started the engine. It can take several minutesto clear the front screen and having the ignition on but the engine off while you use the de-icer won't help your battery last very long.

 

[Hellcat]

Re: dont buy any fiat fitted with a DPF (diesel particulate filter)

The DPF is guaranteed for what exactly?

It won't be guaranteed against becoming blocked. Maybe if the thing rots away and falls off....

 

[D4nny8oy]

Re: dont buy any fiat fitted with a DPF (diesel particulate filter)

Blaming Fiat for the DPF not being covered under 3rd Year is a little unfair considering the 3rd Year cover is not provided by Fiat themselves. So really your anger should be directed towards the 3rd Year warranty company. In some cases though, where a vehicle has been maintained on time and at a Dealer throughout it's life, the Dealer can contact Fiat and may get a portion of (or the whole) cost of the repair under goodwill. I suspect the main issue is that the 3rd Year warranty doesn't pay for extended diagnosis, so if a customer refuses to cover the costs it often leads to the Tech having to 'guess' at the answer.

Fiat Dealers are well aware of a long and detailed diagnostic procedure for diagnosing DPF faults including checking for air leaks, EGR/airflow meter issues, removing and checking injectors, camshafts, etc... even the engine oil level can cause problems.

We had a Sedici that would go through a regen, but would be 'blocked' again within a few days. The vehicle drove and performed ok, except for a shuddering at 1700rpm at speed. After carrying out the various tests and checks I found the intercooler had a defect causing a tiny air leak- this alone was enough to disrupt the DPF readings and cause regeneration to be incomplete. Replaced the intercooler (only), carried out a regen, and all was ok.

For a DPF to refuse to regenerate, as in your case, is very unusual and points to an underlying cause. It's likely a new unit would function for a short time before failing just as this one has.

 

[bobian81]

Re: dont buy any fiat fitted with a DPF (diesel particulate filter)

the dealer at hull told me he's had 3 doblos in with dpf problems,
also check out this thread on honest john :
http://www.honestjohn.co.uk/forum/post/index.htm?t=64204

This problem will make second hand dobbies with dpfs on worthless !

 

[D4nny8oy]

Re: dont buy any fiat fitted with a DPF (diesel particulate filter)

Reading those posts on Honest john it's clear that despite all the Service Bulletin's some Dealers/Tech's have little or no understanding of the DPF, which leads to them going down the "Examiner says it's blocked, so we'll replace it" route.

There's more than one 'stage' of clogging, and if need-be a forced regen can be performed. Out of all the Doblo's, Bravo's, Grande's, etc we've sold we've only replaced one DPF which was damaged due to a worn camshaft on a high mileage, poorly maintained vehicle preventing regeneration from clearing the filter effectively.

Only the Ulysse and Scudo use an additive-based system (due to the Citroen/Peugoet link), all other Fiat's use the system based on post-combustion injections of fuel to heat-up the exhaust, and it's recognised by many that the latter is a much better, more efficient design. Granted, when DPF was introduced there were some issues with over-sensitivity of the sensors and such, but these were modified and there has been ECU updates to the injection software and we've had little problems since.

 

[bobian81]

Re: dont buy any fiat fitted with a DPF (diesel particulate filter)

I've been reading that the croma has huge dpf problems, and this is reflecting in the trade values of the car, I've also noticed that the doblo 1.3mj's have took a nosedive also, thankfully our 2 pandas mj's dont have one fitted.
dannyboy, I'm interested in buying a next to new qudo 1.3 mj later this year, do you know if they have a dpf ?
The engine is only 75bhp, so my guess is it hasnt

 

[auto_blanco]

Re: dont buy any fiat fitted with a DPF (diesel particulate filter)

My friends dad has a Nissan Navara (new shape) and he was saying the Fiat dealer he took it for service said they need to let Navaras and Pathfinders cool down if they have been driven at speed before taking them into the workshops as the DPFs can get so hot they can melt the flooring surface they use!

 

[bobian81]

Re: dont buy any fiat fitted with a DPF (diesel particulate filter)

hell fire ! with the fire temps being generated, it must be a bad prognosis if a car fitted with a dpf develops a fuel leak

 

[D4nny8oy]

Re: dont buy any fiat fitted with a DPF (diesel particulate filter)

dannyboy, I'm interested in buying a next to new qudo 1.3 mj later this year, do you know if they have a dpf ?
The engine is only 75bhp, so my guess is it hasnt

More than likely they do- in order to meet Euro5 emission laws. The 500 has them as standard.

Haven't had a single issue with DPF's on any Croma's we've sold, though admittedly they weren't a great seller to begin with.

Fiat recommend any forced regen's are performed outside, and that no rubber-hosed exhaust extractors are fitted over the tailpipe as they'll melt due to the heat. Some Alfa Brera's have had issues with melted bumpers due to the exhaust being routed through them.

 

[T14086]

Re: dont buy any fiat fitted with a DPF (diesel particulate filter)

I'm with Danny on this one....had a few issues with them but always cured the fault without replacing the filter.

If you think about it the DPF itself is very reliable, perhaps (as Danny stated) the other dealers were unaware of certain documentation or didn't understand the parameters displayed infront of them?

 

[NumanR]

Re: dont buy any fiat fitted with a DPF (diesel particulate filter)

First post on honest john, says plugged it onto Snapon Modus, (not Fiat equipment), so we have a guy going to a back street garage, they say your dpf is blocked will need a new one, and phone up dealer and ask how much? Not a very technical approach is it (bashing out the centre). IF you ask the experts, WHICH certain of us are, YOU will find that dpf is a very good system which after a few software issues is proving very reliable. Catalytic converter temperatures used to be just as high, and they are on petrol cars where the risk of a fuel leak is just as high, and the fuel more volatile, there is more of them on the road and do you here of these catching fire in great numbers? NO. We have been working on dpf vehicles for some time now and not had a single dpf filter fail due to the dpf system itself, we have had 1 fail due to poor maintenance and a worn out camshaft. Thats it, a garage in a city, with no other dealers within 30 miles of it so a large catchment area, and a large Doblo fleet being used by taxis, vans and the public.

 

[fenton_jd]

Re: dont buy any fiat fitted with a DPF (diesel particulate filter)

Do people not take their cars out for a good old thrash down country roads anymore??????

 

[Daver]

Re: dont buy any fiat fitted with a DPF (diesel particulate filter)

A guy at work bought a brand new Audi A3 with a DPF fitted, he had so much trouble with it blocking and going into "limp mode" he sold it after less than 3 months!!
BTW he is a driver, no tootling around for him , its Warp Factor 6 everywhere he goes, young and mad see.

 

[bobian81]

Re: dont buy any fiat fitted with a DPF (diesel particulate filter)

10 years ago when you bought a diesel car, you were buying it for long term reliability and economy, if you changed the oil regular, and the cambelt at 60k, they would go on and on for ever, not so now a modern tuned up diesel (this is not just fiat but all makes) thet are tempremental and unreliable.
I wouldnt set out in to the australian outback in a modern diesel with all its fancy computer gizmos, dpfs turbos etc, in case the engine breathed in a bit of dust and decided to go into limp mode. Give me a good old fashioned landy with a perkins lump in it any day.
As for the environment, how can it be any better with a dpf on ?
All it does is convert the soot particles into co2, so it still ends up in the environment, one could make an arguement that it worse as co2, because soot particles only stay in the atmosphere for 10 days before being washed to earth in the rain.

 

[NumanR]

Re: dont buy any fiat fitted with a DPF (diesel particulate filter)

I guess you just want to live ten years ago then.

 

[bobian81]

Re: dont buy any fiat fitted with a DPF (diesel particulate filter)

Do people not take their cars out for a good old thrash down country roads anymore??????

no because theres usually a nasty ol speed camera hiding in the bushes !

 

[Citizen Smith]

Re: dont buy any fiat fitted with a DPF (diesel particulate filter)

no because theres usually a nasty ol speed camera hiding in the bushes !

... but you dont have to trash cars with DPF just low revs in highest gear possible at all times :bang: if people bothered themselves to be educated on the vehicle their buying and how to use it correctly it would not be a problem. All they see is high mpg and nothing else.

 

[Renegade_8]

Re: dont buy any fiat fitted with a DPF (diesel particulate filter)

10 years ago when you bought a diesel car, you were buying it for long term reliability and economy, if you changed the oil regular, and the cambelt at 60k, they would go on and on for ever, not so now a modern tuned up diesel (this is not just fiat but all makes) thet are tempremental and unreliable.
I wouldnt set out in to the australian outback in a modern diesel with all its fancy computer gizmos, dpfs turbos etc, in case the engine breathed in a bit of dust and decided to go into limp mode. Give me a good old fashioned landy with a perkins lump in it any day.

When I read a thread like this I regret parting company with my Tempra TD. That car would last for ever if properly looked after, and no electonics, no engine management software no catalyst...

 

[T14086]

Re: dont buy any fiat fitted with a DPF (diesel particulate filter)

When I read a thread like this I regret parting company with my Tempra TD. That car would last for ever if properly looked after, and no electonics, no engine management software no catalyst...

These days were all supposed to help the enviroment though.