Cheap OBD2 diagnostics?

[portland_bill]

By servo, I guess you mean the steering motor.
Correct, no adapter is needed for the steering.

At the top of the long list of vehicles, in the text no-one reads, (I had to go and look, I couldn't remember what it meant, but knew it would be there somewhere) it states that the lines in red are restricted in the free version of MES. Items can be connected to, but with limited access, giving only the component info. For fault codes, you need the licensed version.

 

[varesecrazy]

And the RED boxes A1 and A2
Are the Adaptor cables..

Listed at the bottom of MES page..

( took me a while to find that recently )

 

[Diwiak]

For testing the command sets of the ELM327; If you have an Android phone there is an application called "ELM327 Identifier" by Daaren Fonloil(similar app exists on Windows). It will easily test your adapter. What you're looking for is all green bars from version 1.0 to 1.4. Even if only one command fails, it's no good. And last of all, Bluetooth version 4.0 ELM327 clones are usually buggy with MES/AlfaOBD.

Thanks for help I discovered lot of new things ,

from the log all commands are fine till v1.4 - 1.4b and higher are not working. So I think interface is fine and Steering/Airbags should be fine with this??

Now Iam quite busy but hopefully I will dig through that PCB soon make some measurements and let know.

Scan date=2020-08-01 16:43:14
Device name=OBDII
Device mac=00:06:71:00:00:06
Device Version (Declared)=ELM327 v1.5

Command Version Result
AT@1 1.0 OK
ATSPA6 1.0 OK
ATTPA6 1.0 OK
ATTP6 1.0 OK
ATSP00 1.3 OK
ATSP6 1.0 OK
ATAL 1.0 OK
ATNL 1.0 OK
ATAMC 2.0 KO
ATAMT20 2.0 KO
ATRA70 1.3 OK
ATSR70 1.2 OK
ATAR 1.2 OK
ATAT0 1.2 OK
ATAT2 1.2 OK
ATAT1 1.2 OK
ATBD 1.0 OK
ATBRT0F 1.2 OK
ATCAF0 1.0 OK
ATCAF1 1.0 OK
ATCEA04 1.4 OK
ATCERF1 2.2 KO
ATCEA 1.4 OK
ATCF00000111 1.0 OK
ATCF111 1.0 OK
ATCFC0 1.0 OK
ATCFC1 1.0 OK
ATCM00000111 1.0 OK
ATCM111 1.0 OK
ATCP18 1.0 OK
ATCRA7C0 1.3 OK
ATCRA000007C0 1.3 OK
ATCRA 1.4b KO
ATCS 1.0 OK
ATCSM0 1.4b KO
ATCSM1 1.4b KO
ATCTM5 2.1 KO
ATCTM1 2.1 KO
ATCV0000 1.4 OK
ATD1 1.3 OK
ATD0 1.3 OK
ATDP 1.0 OK
ATDPN 1.0 OK
ATE0 1.0 OK
ATE1 1.0 OK
ATFCSD0430FF00 1.1 OK
ATFCSH000007B0 1.1 OK
ATFCSH7B0 1.1 OK
ATFCSM0 1.1 OK
ATFE 1.3a OK
ATH0 1.0 OK
ATH1 1.0 OK
ATI 1.0 OK
ATIB10 1.0 OK
ATIB12 2.2 KO
ATIB15 2.2 KO
ATIB48 1.4 OK
ATIB96 1.0 OK
ATIFRS 1.2 OK
ATIFRH 1.2 OK
ATIFR0 1.2 OK
ATIFR2 1.2 OK
ATIFR1 1.2 OK
ATIFR6 2.2 KO
ATIFR5 2.2 KO
ATIFR4 2.2 KO
ATIGN 1.4 OK
ATIIA7A 1.2 OK
ATJS 1.3 OK
ATJE 1.3 OK
ATJHF0 1.4b KO
ATJHF1 1.4b KO
ATJTM5 1.4b KO
ATJTM1 1.4b KO
ATKW 1.3 OK
ATKW0 1.2 OK
ATKW1 1.2 OK
ATL0 1.0 OK
ATL1 1.0 OK
ATM1 1.0 OK
ATM0 1.0 OK
ATPPFFON 1.1 OK
ATPPFFOFF 1.1 OK
ATR0 1.0 OK
ATR1 1.0 OK
ATRV 1.0 OK
ATS0 1.3 OK
ATS1 1.3 OK
ATSDFF 1.4 OK
ATRD 1.4 OK
ATSH000007E0 2.0 KO
ATSHA848F1 1.0 OK
ATSH7B0 1.0 OK
ATST32 1.0 OK
ATSWFF 1.0 OK
ATTAF9 1.4 OK
ATV1 1.3 OK
ATV0 1.3 OK
ATWMC133F13E 1.0 OK
ATPC 1.0 OK
ATWS 1.0 OK
ATD 1.0 OK
ATZ 1.0 OK

 

[Diwiak]

Hi,

si I borrowed genuine Delphi diagnosis, and its working nice engine+steering+abs, except I can not read Airbag module - its trying to connect, blinking and clicking sounds, but without success - any ideas?
Also there is no LiveData available in Delphi (but for LiveData Iam using ELM327 with FES so this dont bother me).

Thanks

 

[s130]

Regarding the Airbag system then you probably need a VAG KKL interface.

Even on the Barchetta II vehicles that have the 16 PIN EOBD connector you can not connect to the Airbag system using ELM. You need to use a KKL interface.

 

[varesecrazy]

Regarding the Airbag system then you probably need a VAG KKL interface.

Even on the Barchetta II vehicles that have the 16 PIN EOBD connector you can not connect to the Airbag system using ELM. You need to use a KKL interface.

Correct

Their quote from the MES site already conformed this..


But they only asked about the adaptors

 

[The Captain 007]

If it helps anyone, I borrowed a top of the line diagnostics machine from iCarsoft but also used the multiecuscan software with a cheap interface (about £6 and it produced far better results than the expensive machine. The Multiecuscan software is free but I paid for the licence to remove any restrictions. It is also cheap compared to a peice of commercial hardward.

 

[varesecrazy]

If it helps anyone, I borrowed a top of the line diagnostics machine from iCarsoft but also used the multiecuscan software with a cheap interface (about £6 and it produced far better results than the expensive machine. The Multiecuscan software is free but I paid for the licence to remove any restrictions. It is also cheap compared to a peice of commercial hardward.

An all too common discovery,

After a painful and expensive parts swapping game at "local garages"

 

[The Captain 007]

An all too common discovery,

After a painful and expensive parts swapping game at "local garages"

Sorry to hear that. Hopefully you got to the bottom of the problem in the end. I have some difficult problems at the moment and will post about them and hope anyone else has resolved similar

 

[Diwiak]

If it helps anyone, I borrowed a top of the line diagnostics machine from iCarsoft but also used the multiecuscan software with a cheap interface (about £6 and it produced far better results than the expensive machine. The Multiecuscan software is free but I paid for the licence to remove any restrictions. It is also cheap compared to a peice of commercial hardward.

Which car/engine/year? Iam looking for reader/software combo which can reset service interval for a 2019 Panda 1.2 Euro6. That probably could be OBD socket bypas needed but Iam not sure and dont want spend money for something that wont work, Thanks

 

[The Captain 007]

I am pretty sure it will do it but you can check with them

My advice would be to pay the additional and order the wire from them too. They have v good support so you can just email them or maybe call and ask.

Mine was a 500x lounge 1.4 2016

HEre is a list of cars covered and their tech stuff re pins and leads etc

https://multiecuscan.com/SupportedVehiclesList.aspx

Hope this helps

 

[Twotone2]

Which car/engine/year? Iam looking for reader/software combo which can reset service interval for a 2019 Panda 1.2 Euro6. That probably could be OBD socket bypas needed but Iam not sure and dont want spend money for something that wont work, Thanks

I’ve just bought the Can version of mes it comes with a reader and an adapter (type 3 yellow) and a QuickStart guide which tells you to download mes but use the free version to scan the car first before registering the software to see if the car has a secure gateway port if it does then you need to buy a SGN adapter.

The adapter is available to buy on Gendan’s site along with whatever bundle of mes that you want to buy my bundle was £112 delivered and I didn’t need a SGN adapter. The also do a multiplex version which is their commercial version of mes costs £345 but that version connects to any Fiat car (and other cars) without any other adapters and it can be used on multiple computers.

12 + 8-pin Bypass adaptor for FIAT, Alfa Romeo & Chrysler vehicles with a Security Gateway Module

12 + 8-pin Bypass adaptor for FIAT, Alfa Romeo & Chrysler vehicles with a Security Gateway Module - only £24.95 including VAT & UK delivery!

www.gendan.co.uk

MultiECUScan CAN-only Diagnostic Bundle for some Fiat and Alfa Romeo cars (Single PC)

MultiECUScan CAN-only Diagnostic Bundle for some Fiat and Alfa Romeo cars (Single PC) - only £112.94 including VAT & UK delivery!

www.gendan.co.uk

MultiECUScan Multiplexed Diagnostic Package for Fiat / Alfa Romeo / Lancia cars (Multiple PCs)

MultiECUScan Multiplexed Diagnostic Package for Fiat / Alfa Romeo / Lancia cars (Multiple PCs) - only £345.00 including VAT & UK delivery!

www.gendan.co.uk

 

[varesecrazy]

Gendan are UK distributors

Fiat's Scan is a product of EasternEurope

So @Diwiak may well find local support

SGW and a panda.. Quite possibly not an issue

My 2018 model500 has no SGW and that was an updated build to include a 3rd stalk, Speed Control

Panda didn't get that update

 

[Twotone2]

Gendan are UK distributors

Fiat's An is a product of EaternEurope

So @Diwiak may well find local support

SGW and a panda.. Quite possibly not an issue

My 2018 model500 has no SGW and that was an updated build to include a 3rd stalk, Speed Control

Panda didn't get that update

Aye my 2023 TA Panda 4x4 doesn’t have a SGW.

 

[s130]

The also do a multiplex version which is their commercial version of mes costs about £300 but that version connects to any Fiat car (and other cars) without any other adapters and it can be used on multiple computers and has a lifetime warranty/subscription of mes.

Just want to clarify "lifetime subscription/license".

When you buy MES the license works in the followings way.

1) With the multiplexed version then the license is tied to the interface. This means any laptop can be used with the multiplex interface on any car. The license provides ONE YEAR of updates only. The software and interface will continue to work after the year however for bug fixes and new vehicles a new supported vehicles a new license is required.

2) With ELM/OBDLink/KKL (i.e. non multiplexed) then the license if tied to the specific PC/laptop you install the software on. You can use "this" PC/laptop on any car. If you want to use anther PC/laptop then you have to electronically transfer the license to the new PC/laptop. The original PC will revert to an unlicensed version but still work but with restrictions. The license operates in the time way as for multiplexed version regarding one year updates and continued use thereafter.

 

[s130]

Aye my 2023 TA Panda 4x4 doesn’t have a SGW.

Lucky you and Me. Your Panda TA as far as Fiat and SGW is not a NEW model. It is an updated old model. (no offense meant)

It is basically NEW model cars post 2015 (ish) that have the SGW. My Fiat 500X 1.4 dodged the SGW bullet. Later 500X, Tipo, 124, Mito, etc. generally have the SGW.

The bad and also good news for all of us (with or without SGW) is the SGW was a HACK. It is now every manufacturer's intention to only allow/use Pass-Thru SJ2534) on their latest models.

See: https://www.maverickdiagnostics.com/pass-thru-diagnostics-in-the-uk-europe/

Pass-Thru is basically the protocol *with an associated account* to get/change vehicle data and the encryption key for each specific vehicle to allow write updates and actuator operations.

I say we with or without SGW are lucky is that even if you have and SGW you can bypass it. Give manufacture's time and the security will be integrated directly into the ECUs. It is the EU's intention to bring into force Encrypted CAN.

See:https://www.sae.org/publications/technical-papers/content/2019-01-0098/

Basically we, the DIYer, are going to be royaly stuffed unless you can afford the pro kit AND the anually fees charge by Fiat (£1500 ish) to connect to their servers. This will also rule out some garages unless there is a central "one account" for all makes. Only garages that deal with reasonable numbers of cars per yer will bother or be able to afford the operational costs. If an independent garage sees 1000 Fords a year and only 20 Fiats then you know what there business decision will be. No Fiats that require EOBD actions. Standard mechanical only and then why would they bother? Too much hassle.

Yours - "Mr Doom & Gloom"

 

[Twotone2]

Lucky you and Me. Your Panda TA as far as Fiat and SGW is not a NEW model. It is an updated old model. (no offense meant)

It is basically NEW model cars post 2015 (ish) that have the SGW. My Fiat 500X 1.4 dodged the SGW bullet. Later 500X, Tipo, 124, Mito, etc. generally have the SGW.

The bad and also good news for all of us (with or without SGW) is the SGW was a HACK. It is now every manufacturer's intention to only allow/use Pass-Thru SJ2534) on their latest models.

See: https://www.maverickdiagnostics.com/pass-thru-diagnostics-in-the-uk-europe/

Pass-Thru is basically the protocol *with an associated account* to get/change vehicle data and the encryption key for each specific vehicle to allow write updates and actuator operations.

I say we with or without SGW are lucky is that even if you have and SGW you can bypass it. Give manufacture's time and the security will be integrated directly into the ECUs. It is the EU's intention to bring into force Encrypted CAN.

See:https://www.sae.org/publications/technical-papers/content/2019-01-0098/

Basically we, the DIYer, are going to be royaly stuffed unless you can afford the pro kit AND the anually fees charge by Fiat (£1500 ish) to connect to their servers. This will also rule out some garages unless there is a central "one account" for all makes. Only garages that deal with reasonable numbers of cars per yer will bother or be able to afford the operational costs. If an independent garage sees 1000 Fords a year and only 20 Fiats then you know what there business decision will be. No Fiats that require EOBD actions. Standard mechanical only and then why would they bother? Too much hassle.

Yours - "Mr Doom & Gloom"

I was speaking with my local garage/mechanic about this (he had to look at my van’s computer down to the warning triangle on the dash) and he was saying he’s had to buy a reader for £900 plus a subscription think he said that lets him access Ford and German vehicles he was also saying that years ago he could phone the manufacturer for ‘technical’ advice and they’d tell him what a particular fault was but he said they no longer provide that service, as a boiler repairer I can contact all boiler manufacturers and they’ll provide free ‘technical assistance’ in fact they’ll provide that information to almost anyone however most as for my gas safe registration number when they answer the phone.

 

[The Captain 007]

Thanks. I have cheap ELM327 adaptor with shortened Pin 7, I can access engine+ABS, but nothing else. MES says electric delphi servo can be accessed only by ELM, is KKL/Vagcom any compatible?

Ive been searching a bit about those cheap Delphi interfaces, afaik its 1to1 copy of genuine Delphi interface with "fixed" genuine software, means illegal, you are fine with it anyway until you dont connect to internet and for cars manufactured till some 2015-17, new software (2017+) is much better protected. Delphi is charging approx. 2000 for interface and 600 annualy for updates so nothing special they are fighting it seriously ;-).

Well going back to the compatibility problem, I use the ELM 327 v 1.4 and the yellow adapter. I cannot speak definitely for your car but with mine if you try to access a module not supported by the elm, it tells you to pluc in the yellow adapter. So far I have not found a module it would not connect to.

I believe to change teh service interval you need to plug in the yellow adapter.

 

[Diwiak]

Thanks to all. What about "AlfaOBD" software, comes as Android app as well, anyone use that?

 

[varesecrazy]

Thanks to all. What about "AlfaOBD" software, comes as Android app as well, anyone use that?

Some do,
it has "different features"

I was tempted, but think MES has better support, especially for EnglishLanguage

So bought a newer MES licence

50Euro /£43 is a bargain