Technical All-season tyres better than winter tyres, for 215/45 R17 XL Y ?

[Zardo]

Hi,

I've always had two sets of wheels:
1. summer tyres
2. winter tyres

Now, it appears that there has been a lot of progress with All-season tyres in the last years.

For example, an All-Season tyre has beaten several dedicated winter tyres on snow.



This is particularly evident when comparing the track data with the winter tyre test.



As we don't actually have that much snow anymore in Central Europe I think a dedicated winter tyre isn't really needed and an All-Season tyre might be better most of the time during the cold season, especially in cold and wet or dry conditions.
I'm not planning to use an All-Season tyre in summer, as summer tyres are still clearly superior in summer.
So instead of fitting winter tyres for the cold season, I'm thinking about fitting All-season tyres for the cold season only.
All-season tyres might actually beat winter tyres during the cold season in most situations, with the exception of, maybe deep snow. And they're legal to drive with their three peaks logo.
As for the 215/45 R17 XL 91 Y size, I hesitate between:
- Winter tyres
Pirelli Soto zero
Continental TS 870 (only in V speed category)
Michelin Alpine

-All-season tyres:
- Pirelli All season Cinturato SF2 (SF3 is not available yet for this size)
- Michelin CrossClimate 2
- Continental All-season contact (2 is not available)
- Goodyear Vector 4Seasons Gen-3

The Pirelli seem to be eaten away quickly.
Goodyear Vector seems to have excellent mileage. The Michelin CrossClimate 2 seems to be excellent on snow, but has a slight weakness on wet surfaces.

Rim protection is also important.

What do you think?

 

[StevenRB45]

It really depends on where you live.

In genuine alpine and Nordic conditions the winter tyre is superior it is designed to be.

The all-season is a jack of all trades and while definitely very good if you're going to be getting winter conditions for months on end I'd stick with the separate sets.

Also they don't drive particularly well I've had Goodyear Vectors gen 3s for a long time and I like them but in summer it's the wrong tyre really on a performance car and in winter a proper winter tyre will be better.

For my cars which aren't performance cars and our winters which are mainly wet with the odd cold blast this is fine. Don't know if I'd recommend them on a performance car year round in Switzerland if you're up in the mountains though.

 

[lunchbeers]

I've had cross climate 2s on both my Panda, replacing the original Continentals and my current 1 series, and have found them fantastic.

I had no complaints with the Continentals other than being the original ones and over 10 years old, the cross climate seem a bit more compliant and road noise was reduced - not massively so, it was a TwinAir Panda so a bit noisy anyway...

My BMW is transformed, coming from the old Bridgestone Runflats which would break traction at low speeds in the cold, never mind wet, often with some alarming results. Whilst no performance car, it's no slouch and I have never had any cause for complaint with them, ths car had handled wet, greasy and icy roads without hassle, and I do rag it a bit.

One gripe about the cross climate is no rim protection, but that hasn't been too much of an issue - I am an All-Season convert now!

I will be trying the Goodyears on my 4x4 Yeti this year as Costco has them for £110 a corner

 

[The Panda Nut]

Only on a Panda but I run Michelin Alpin and am very happy with the performance. Below 8C or so they perform vastly better than anything else I have tried. In warmer conditions there is is less notable difference and as the temperature comes up they are not as good as the summer continental tyres I use. They are good in the wet and have worn very well too. Performance on ice and snow seems really good, I wouldnt run them in the warmer months. I put Goodyear vector all seasons on my daughters car (Panda 2wd) which seem quieter than the Michelon and also perform fine I couldnt really say which are better overall. For lot of the time all seasons (Goodyear) would be acceptable for most situations so seem a good compromise for UK conditions. I would take the Alpins for snow and ice I think but Goodyear all seasons are still good . I do not think any of the winter and all seasons tyres are as good on warm dry roads, but unless driving and cornering fast all the time would be OK for summer use. I expect they would wear faster than summer tyres though? I like having two sets so my alloy wheels avoid salt, but one set of all seasons seems to make sense. Having tried both Michelin and Goodyear all seasons, I prefer the grip of the Goodyears but suspect the wear rate is more than Michelin. Due to changing cars I have no evidence only feelings to base this on.

 

[StevenRB45]

Having tried both Michelin and Goodyear all seasons, I prefer the grip of the Goodyears but suspect the wear rate is more than Michelin. Due to changing cars I have no evidence only feelings to base this on.

I have a pair of Goodyears that have done 30k, around 10 of which was on the front..I meant to be swap them back but I've had 2 irreparable punctures which ended up on the front.

I'm put off the Michelin by them seeming to age terribly with age cracking coming on much faster than I've seen on other tyres on the cross climate.

Not exactly ideal for a tyre that is going to be in storage 50% of the year although it being out of UV might help it.

 

[Bonefish Blues]

I have a pair of Goodyears that have done 30k, around 10 of which was on the front..I meant to be swap them back but I've had 2 irreparable punctures which which ended up on the front.

I'm put off the Michelin by them seeming to age terribly with age cracking coming on much faster than I've seen on other tyres on the cross climate.

Not exactly ideal for a tyre that is going to be in storage 50% of the year although it being out of UV might help it.

The CC2 is a tyre that's not particularly good but sells by the bucketload, it seems to me.

 

[StevenRB45]

The CC2 is a tyre that's not particularly good but sells by the bucketload, it seems to me.

It reviews well due to being very very good in certain characteristics eg. Snow but is not a very rounded tyre (lol) in that it also has some less than ideal characteristics that get tidied up by the average.

The Goodyear isn't excellent in any respect but is just a stable tyre.

 

[Bonefish Blues]

My Vreds suit the roly-poly nature of a Panda 4x4 down to the ground.

Which is lucky because generally there's more grip on the ground than in the air.

 

[StevenRB45]

A good all-season is largely un-expectional in all circumstances.

The exceptional part comes in that in summer it doesn't fall to bits and in winter it doesn't attempt to kill you and its more than passable in between the 2 points.

Most All-Seasons are quite soft the Goodyears are also quite an imprecise tyre but they ride nice if adding an extra layer of wool to steering.

 

[The Panda Nut]

I have a pair of Goodyears that have done 30k, around 10 of which was on the front..I meant to be swap them back but I've had 2 irreparable punctures which ended up on the front.

I'm put off the Michelin by them seeming to age terribly with age cracking coming on much faster than I've seen on other tyres on the cross climate.

Not exactly ideal for a tyre that is going to be in storage 50% of the year although it being out of UV might help it.

I tried the first cross climates years ago and they were not a lot of good anywhere. They well put me off all seasons tyres. Im sure the succeeding versions are big steps forward as several people on here praise them. I was a Goodyear man for decades and wouldnt have anything else, but they started to wear too fast for my budget (in the 90's) so switched to Bridgestone after getting good value from our Seat and a set on a company car that did over 80K. I eventually stopped using them because they keep changing the tread pattern so often that I never had a matching set. I moved onto Continental over 10 years back because of good reviews and they were a massive step up from the Bridgestones as well, but expensive. I couldn't get Continental winters in 2019 so settled on Michelin Alpin as their new tyres seem as good as it gets (again at a price). I have no regrets on the Alpins. Ruby (wifes Panda 1.2) runs on Goodyear as does my daughters 2016 1.2 car. That one had to have 2 slightly worn Goodyears thrown out last year as they were extremely badly cracked. You just dont know what secondhand cars / tyres have been through so no idea why they were so bad. The remaining two will be removed this spring and 2 more Vectors put on. I need at least 1 tyre on Ruby, so probably a pair. This is to replace the last original which still has 4.5mm at 43K miles. Goodyear will get the job if they have tread matching the others. We now have 2 Pandas on the 185 tyres so I can keep the decent one to be run out in due course. I am pretty serious about tyre selection having been in a couple of extraordinary skids many years back that really put the wind up me and changed my selection criteria to GRIP, GRIP and GRIP. These days there is a much better choice and most tyres are OK. I just want my stopping distance to be the best possible (tests show big differences) and frankly, hang the cost. Who knows if its ever saved me. I hope not but I think money spent on the best tyres is never mis-spent.