not bad for toodling around Bolivia!
General High Mileage
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General High Mileage
not bad for toodling around Bolivia!
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My TA still only has ~6000km on it, so the mileage still sucks. For now I just drive it like an Italian. Once it's broken in I'll might try driving it for economy again. Right now, my 2 tonne VW Transporter is matching UFI. Although UFI can beat the T5, I'd wager that driven side by side on the same roads, the T5 would come out ahead. I've managed 700km before, but there was only about 0.5l left in the tank, mind you I usually run it that low.
Accelerating hard means the engine is at it's most efficient
High load/ medium revs.
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It's really quite different from driving 'sensibly'.
A: It involves hard acceleration (to the point where my T5's TC is always kicking in, and the front tyre are shot:devil
, this is where peak efficiency occurs for ICE engines (around 100% load).B: It involves never using the brakes and maintaining high corner speeds.
C: It involves spending time/ money on things like ECU remaps, LRR tyres, fuel instrumentation, electric power steer, lithium starting batteries, supercaps, solar panels, light weight parts etc. The T5's been mapped up to a tyre shredding 460Nm, with more to come.
D: It's done as a hobby (with competitions for those inclined). Personally I do it as a game you can play in peak hour, just like beating a PB high score in a video game. I'm interested in efficiency and don't care if I'm actually saving money.
My new Renault's first tank came in at just over 50% better than the official figure, I'm hoping to be averaging half the official consumption on a run in engine and some light mods.
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If you stay within pure electric range and don't factor in electricity use, you can have infinite MPG, so your 89MPG is meaningless
Sweetsixteen
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Ahhh! ...Now I understand.
It's not really about overall economy. It's more like a hobby where you spend pounds in one area to save pennies in another, and get satisfaction while doing so.
Whatever turns you on - it's a free society after all.
Me - I also have several vehicles which I drive according to their individual characters, but when I drive my Panda Multijet I always aim for lowest running costs, because that's largely the reason why I bought it. That includes not just fuel economy, but tyre wear, brake longevity, engine/gearbox sympathy, etc. Long may it last.
It's not really about overall economy. It's more like a hobby where you spend pounds in one area to save pennies in another, and get satisfaction while doing so.
Whatever turns you on - it's a free society after all.
Me - I also have several vehicles which I drive according to their individual characters, but when I drive my Panda Multijet I always aim for lowest running costs, because that's largely the reason why I bought it. That includes not just fuel economy, but tyre wear, brake longevity, engine/gearbox sympathy, etc. Long may it last.
I'm a keen cyclist and have spent a small fortune on bikes and equipment.
I commuted to work for years (retired now) and saved the petrol money by cycling. My bike cost more than my car!
Regards,
Mick
Sweetsixteen
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Congrats Mick!
Dangerous hobby now - some car drivers deliberately target cyclists.
Hope you've got a good helmet
Dangerous hobby now - some car drivers deliberately target cyclists.
Hope you've got a good helmet
I'm always amused by peoples aversion to what they consider to be high mileage. 100k is nothing IF the vehicle has been treated sympathetically. By that I mean letting the oil fully warm before you give it full throttle/medium to high rev’s. Good quality oil. Well serviced, which probably means doing it yourself or keeping away from main dealers etc.
Our other cars have done 197k and 255k miles. Neither have been near a main dealer since they were 2 years old. The 197k one, a VW T4 did unfortunately eat it’s own engine at about 190k. I’d heard a rattle from the cam belt area and made a note to check it out. Yep the cam belt tensioner failed the day after, it actually carried on running but that equalled 5 cracked pistons If it wasn't for that I would have expected 300k+
Our other cars have done 197k and 255k miles. Neither have been near a main dealer since they were 2 years old. The 197k one, a VW T4 did unfortunately eat it’s own engine at about 190k. I’d heard a rattle from the cam belt area and made a note to check it out. Yep the cam belt tensioner failed the day after, it actually carried on running but that equalled 5 cracked pistons
If it wasn't for that I would have expected 300k+
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I'm a keen cyclist and have spent a small fortune on bikes and equipment.
I commuted to work for years (retired now) and saved the petrol money by cycling. My bike cost more than my car!
Regards,
Mick
I used to commute on a MTB on slick tyres. Wanting something that wouldn't get me so sweaty in the mornings, I bought a road bike for around $2000 - not top end but not junk. Within a few months the wheels (brake surfaces) had worn out. Tyres at around $80 each, tubes, bearings, pedals all have a very short life compared to car milages. Conclusion is if you have a car anyway and commute longer distances, a bike won't save you money! And yes, I now have the equivalent of a new 500 'invested' in my bikes
Seriously? Ive got a crossover type car with the same. Id have thought the 500 was better than that.
You've got to remember that cd is only part of the story. Today drag is cd x frontal area
One of the inferences you can draw from the Cd is how much the car's economy is going to be affected by your choice of cruising speed.
Put simply, the higher the Cd, the more economy will suffer (in percentage terms) as steady-state speed increases.
Put simply, the higher the Cd, the more economy will suffer (in percentage terms) as steady-state speed increases.
Sweetsixteen
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... Which also means that in city driving, Cd differences don't count for much. It's when you get to drive long motorway journeys that Cd efficiency makes itself felt.
Stating the obvious really, but such basics are often overlooked. Your driving habits and environment should be taken into account when comparing car Cd's before buying.
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You've got to remember that cd is only part of the story. Today drag is cd x frontal area
Except the 500 doesn't have an especially small frontal area compared to the smaller SUV/Crossovers though.
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-hnREd5U4x...TA/s1600/Fiat-500-dimensions-blueprint-lg.jpg
http://drawingdatabase.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/Nissan_Juke_2010.jpg
The Juke is a bit taller, but it rides higher, so the body height might even be lower, it's wider though so perhaps the CdA is 10% greater, which is not much.
And an E-Class:
http://www.the-blueprints.com/bluep...es/mercedes_benz_e_class_coupe_2010-38188.jpg
The E is about 160mm wider but also 100mm lower. CdA is about the same...
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Not really true, at 50km/h upwards, aerodynamics already account for 50% of a 500's drag.
Sweetsixteen
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That's true, and it really serves to emphasise my point.
Below 50kph, as in city driving, the differences in Cd between small cars are minimised when compared to the proportionately bigger influence that individual driving habits (hard acceleration and braking, for example) have over fuel consumption.
On a motorway, where speeds are generally steadier and higher, Cd plays a proportionately greater role.
Below 50kph, as in city driving, the differences in Cd between small cars are minimised when compared to the proportionately bigger influence that individual driving habits (hard acceleration and braking, for example) have over fuel consumption.
On a motorway, where speeds are generally steadier and higher, Cd plays a proportionately greater role.
Irish 500
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My TA still only has ~6000km on it, so the mileage still sucks. For now I just drive it like an Italian. Once it's broken in I'll might try driving it for economy again. Right now, my 2 tonne VW Transporter is matching UFI. Although UFI can beat the T5, I'd wager that driven side by side on the same roads, the T5 would come out ahead. I've managed 700km before, but there was only about 0.5l left in the tank, mind you I usually run it that low.
Accelerating hard means the engine is at it's most efficient
This is absolutely correct; the engine delivers peak power at a defined speed and the quicker you get the engine up to this speed the more efficient it will be. Over this speed, the only benefit is to the Chancellor of the exchequer and the oil companies.
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It's really quite different from driving 'sensibly'.
A: It involves hard acceleration (to the point where my T5's TC is always kicking in, and the front tyre are shot:devil
B: It involves never using the brakes and maintaining high corner speeds.
C: It involves spending time/ money on things like ECU remaps, LRR tyres, fuel instrumentation, electric power steer, lithium starting batteries, supercaps, solar panels, light weight parts etc. The T5's been mapped up to a tyre shredding 460Nm, with more to come.
D: It's done as a hobby (with competitions for those inclined). Personally I do it as a game you can play in peak hour, just like beating a PB high score in a video game. I'm interested in efficiency and don't care if I'm actually saving money.
In my haste to differentiate hypermiling from 'driving sensibly' I may have given people the wrong impression.
I would view it as a from of motorsport, it's not that different from circuit racing or rallying or even dyno pulls, just that sucess is measured with a different metric.
As with any type of motoring or motorsport, people will have different motivations.
These could be saving money, saving the planet, learning about different techniques and technologies, even just something to do on a boring commute.
Hypermiling on it's own doesn't require spending money on modifications, or putting excess wear on any vehicle parts. Some more advanced techniques may theoretically cause additional wear but typically this wear will be offset by reduced wear to another component.
Personally, I'm beating the official cycle results by 40% across two vehicles with technique alone. I've seen people manage 60%.
Hypermiling requires a lot of concentration and anticipation to do well, I can only surmise that this makes hypermilers safer than the average phone talking SUV driver. There are of course unsafe techniques, just like there are for any other drivers.
Hypermiling isn't driving slow. Although my TDi will spin it's wheels at peak efficiency, it's the only vehicle I've come across to do so. Most cars will be accelerating slightly faster than the average traffic flow.
Now what I was perhaps better describing was 'Ecomodding', once you've reached your driving limit, you might be tempted to modify your car for further gains. For most people, technique is the lion's share, but modifications can have a huge impact too.
Like hypermiling, ecomodding can have different motivations. Some people will want a quick return on their investment, some people have the skill to do major surgery like engine/trans swaps and even roof chops, and treat it more as a hobby where your investment might never be recouped (much like modified cars [and hobbies] in general).
My most expensive single mod, my TDi remap has a long payback, but will still save around $1000 over a lifetime (at current prices of course).
