Technical Rear brake line fittings

[Calecosse]

As my other thread I'm doing a rear axle replacement on my panda. Unfortunately when I took it apart the brake line unions were fairly corroded and bound up so I had to cut the pipe. I'm going to make a short piece from the existing steel pipe to the flexi. So one male union on the existing pipe that runs the length of the car, then a small piece with one end female going to that and the other end male going into the flexi.

I was under the impression that pandas were DIN type swages so ordered a DIN kit which I'm waiting to arrive, however I also ordered 2 new flexi's that have arrived and are SAE. All suppliers seem to list the flexis as SAE. So am I OK to use an SAE die to flare the make up pieces now? Or have the flexis possibly been listed everywhere incorrectly?

 

[koalar]

As my other thread I'm doing a rear axle replacement on my panda. Unfortunately when I took it apart the brake line unions were fairly corroded and bound up so I had to cut the pipe. I'm going to make a short piece from the existing steel pipe to the flexi. So one male union on the existing pipe that runs the length of the car, then a small piece with one end female going to that and the other end male going into the flexi.

I was under the impression that pandas were DIN type swages so ordered a DIN kit which I'm waiting to arrive, however I also ordered 2 new flexi's that have arrived and are SAE. All suppliers seem to list the flexis as SAE. So am I OK to use an SAE die to flare the make up pieces now? Or have the flexis possibly been listed everywhere incorrectly?

Here's how I do them

Koalar random thoughts | FIAT Panda (Mk3)

Clutch, gearbox problem You can see the pessure plate here And from further back The inside is normally covered in oil if the input seal/bearing has gone

www.fiatforum.com

This is the connection between the front ridged and Flexi

I have no idea on the rear I have never had to replace them

I assume they will be the same ?

I use cupro nickel pipe from Halfords, it reasonably cheap and takes a flare well

@irc probably knows for sure

 

[Calecosse]

Thank you, I actually just watched a youtube video saying to use the back side of the sae flare tool so its good to see that technique yields good results. Annoyingly I've got to put a flare on the steel pipe still attached to the car aswell, it seems as though that might be a struggle to do with the usual type of flare die. Have you had success doing it this way on steel pipe as well?

 

[koalar]

Nope it will not work,
It says it's not for steel but I haven't tried

 

[irc]

You're probably better off replacing the pipe as far forward as the join under the passenger seat (hidden under a plastic cover). Usually clean and comes apart well.
The original pipes don't re-flare well with normal tools anyway. Even my heavy-duty flaring tool struggles. The coating adds to the problem.

 

[Calecosse]

Ah I didn't realise there was another break under the passenger seat, I didn't take that plastic cover off and assumed it was a single piece forward, I'll do that then as I have loads of pipe and fittings. I can use @koalartechnique and just use copper pipe! Thanks both of you

 

[Calecosse]

You're probably better off replacing the pipe as far forward as the join under the passenger seat (hidden under a plastic cover). Usually clean and comes apart well.
The original pipes don't re-flare well with normal tools anyway. Even my heavy-duty flaring tool struggles. The coating adds to the problem.

Hi @irci just want to double check that you mean there is another union half way down the car directly under the passenger seat for each side? You don't mean the union that is into the flexi on the brackets for the rear axle mounts?

Just want to double check as I'll be hopefully back on it in the morning and I can go straight to it. I tried to find a diagram of the brake lines for the panda but I don't know if it's my terrible googling abilities or what but I can't find anything.

 

[koalar]

 

[Calecosse]

Thank you @koalar you're a diamond. Hopefully the ends of 1 and 2 come apart ok and I'll just make a new line for them!

 

[irc]

Hopefully the ends of 1 and 2 come apart ok

They usually do as they are a bit more sheltered there.
I almost always replace from there when changing a rear beam, as its rare for the other end to come apart without problems.

 

[Calecosse]

Managed to get the brake lines under the passenger seat to seperate with ease, so great thanks to @irc and @koalar for pointing me in that direction. The clips by the fuel tank aren't much fun to get to mind! Got a handheld DIN brake line tool from amazon for 25 quid which seems to do the trick, did one end on each line for now and I'll run it on the car and cut to length and do the other end on the car to suit.

 

[koalar]

Cool, looks like a quality job to me

You probably already know,there's a blob of grease still in the end

 

[Calecosse]

Cool, looks like a quality job to me

You probably already know,there's a blob of grease still in the end

Thanks. Oh yeah I got that out after, it's just a bit of the die grease stuff. Thanks though! Properly impressed with that flaring tool, made a really neat job.

 

[DaveMcT]

Always use red rubber grease on the flare tool and under the nuts for corrosion protection. It's used on brake seals so safe for use elsewhere in the brake system.

A tip for anyone trying to undo the rubber hose at the chassis end - Cut the hose and spin the fragment off the flare nut. The nut will feel "welded to the pipe. Now warm the nut with a gas lighter. Don't go mad - just enough to soften the plastic sleeve (all sensible warnings apply). The nut will now spin loose. The plastic sheath under the nut is toast anyway, because the underlying zinc plating has oxidised and expanded. If the steel has rusted you'll need a new metal pipe. If the steel is ok, a coating of red rubber grease will keep the salt at bay.

My three Pandas have all had this done when hoses were replaced. The pipes are all doing fine with a coat of copper grease over the flare nuts and steel pipe ends. Clean it off for MOT (and reapply later) as testers will assume it's leaking.

 

[vexorg]

Steel pipes can be a pain to flare the ends, you need a very good flaring tool.

 

[Calecosse]

So had a result and she passed the MOT Monday, thanks for the help all. Thought I'd chuck a few photos on after finishing the brake lines and a link to the tool I used as it was pretty handy for doing on car brake lines. I'll try and do a write up of stuff I've done to the car at some point.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Bnineteenteam-Motorcycle-Flaring-Handheld-Automotive/dp/B0D5Q66Z1V/ref=mp_s_a_1_26?adgrpid=162732533722&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.vHvAUU47rnO8Jxe1EvJ9PfO9CPSSo5i3pmZcnAq9UNdSqVcLylnD29oyyu1ruci_6FshwEq6uv2b4rPTOOav2JI2KW9xWcWEifRk1teEVH2ybuP4KdjQxjh9gHXoIEEeGwejsS93LFVT_W2xB4_xox59Xc1c-7XcW3vgUqX0D5wpUxUosrh7J2rXRy5waKGRhhW7_iFlgDILKE6sZPhusw.XQswDyG7J1WwUwY9IJ65YM2Dayhr_0U7sWDbQRyOpt4&dib_tag=se&gad_source=1&hvadid=696679076073&hvdev=m&hvexpln=70&hvlocphy=9192506&hvnetw=g&hvocijid=9470843514328276746--&hvqmt=e&hvrand=9470843514328276746&hvtargid=kwd-871386811891&hydadcr=26137_2651808&keywords=brake+pipe+flaring+tool+amazon&nsdOptOutParam=true&qid=1730286979&sr=8-26

 

[DaveMcT]

Did you flare the steel pipe under the car?

 

[koalar]

Did you flare the steel pipe under the car?

No post 11

 

[Calecosse]

I didn’t in the end, I split the lines under the passanger floor and re-made lines to the back, the joins came apart a lot easier