Technical Qubo 1.3 Non Starter and No Codes

[EathanR]

Hi, bought my parents a Fiat Qubo each, to replace their Pandas which they had both started to dislike. Ones a 2011 which ended up needing a timing chain, that's fine. Got the funky green 2009 one out with the old style multijet engine (looks similar to the Panda engines), MOTd it then got it in for a service. Everything was going fine until I changed the fuel filter, now it won't start.

Fuel is getting to the high pressure pump but nothing past that, except a dribble to the injector furthest from the gearbox. There's no fault codes, so I thought maybe the high pressure pump had failed so I swapped it over from a spares Qubo I bought which I knew ran and it still wouldn't start. Fitted the pump I removed to the spares Qubo and that starts fine.

This green Qubo will start and run on small sprays of easy start but then cuts out and won't restart

It sounds like a bad air lock but I've never had an issue before on the Pandas. Maybe I'm comparing it to a Panda too much. If anyone's experienced similar I'd love to know what to do. Very close to pulling it round and round in second gear and if that doesn't get it going making this green car my spares car and fixing the other

Cheers,
Eathan

 

[bugsymike]

Hi, bought my parents a Fiat Qubo each, to replace their Pandas which they had both started to dislike. Ones a 2011 which ended up needing a timing chain, that's fine. Got the funky green 2009 one out with the old style multijet engine (looks similar to the Panda engines), MOTd it then got it in for a service. Everything was going fine until I changed the fuel filter, now it won't start.

Fuel is getting to the high pressure pump but nothing past that, except a dribble to the injector furthest from the gearbox. There's no fault codes, so I thought maybe the high pressure pump had failed so I swapped it over from a spares Qubo I bought which I knew ran and it still wouldn't start. Fitted the pump I removed to the spares Qubo and that starts fine.

This green Qubo will start and run on small sprays of easy start but then cuts out and won't restart

It sounds like a bad air lock but I've never had an issue before on the Pandas. Maybe I'm comparing it to a Panda too much. If anyone's experienced similar I'd love to know what to do. Very close to pulling it round and round in second gear and if that doesn't get it going making this green car my spares car and fixing the other

Cheers,
Eathan

I wouldn't try to tow start any diesel, especially a chain driven 1.3 Multijet . I bought a non runner Fiat Grande Punto that their garage "mechanic" had tried tow starting after fitting a new battery and starter and it still wouldn't start. The result was the timing chain slipped on the "freewheeling" crankshaft pulley causing loads of problems. Luckily I bought it cheap, the cause of the problem was a rotted wire a few mm from the ECU which tells the relay that operated the fuel pump in the tank and also the starter signal!!!
Since the issue happened after fitting the new filter I would look in that direction.
First can you hear the electric pump in the fuel tank when you first turn the ignition on before trying to crank the engine?
Second if so, undo the outlet from the fuel filter and again turn on ignition to see if fuel comes out.
Third assuming clean fuel comes out with no air bubbles normally if nothing else has changed refit pipe then a few turns on/off of the key should prime the high pressure pump and push out any air bubbles back to the tank via the return pipe and engine should start.
Assuming no wires were dislodged when fitting the fuel filter etc. but as you say no error codes logged.

 

[EathanR]

I wouldn't try to tow start any diesel, especially a chain driven 1.3 Multijet . I bought a non runner Fiat Grande Punto that their garage "mechanic" had tried tow starting after fitting a new battery and starter and it still wouldn't start. The result was the timing chain slipped on the "freewheeling" crankshaft pulley causing loads of problems. Luckily I bought it cheap, the cause of the problem was a rotted wire a few mm from the ECU which tells the relay that operated the fuel pump in the tank and also the starter signal!!!
Since the issue happened after fitting the new filter I would look in that direction.
First can you hear the electric pump in the fuel tank when you first turn the ignition on before trying to crank the engine?
Second if so, undo the outlet from the fuel filter and again turn on ignition to see if fuel comes out.
Third assuming clean fuel comes out with no air bubbles normally if nothing else has changed refit pipe then a few turns on/off of the key should prime the high pressure pump and push out any air bubbles back to the tank via the return pipe and engine should start.
Assuming no wires were dislodged when fitting the fuel filter etc. but as you say no error codes logged.

Hi,

Cheers for response. The electric pump is loud and clear when you turn ignition on (I swapped it anyway for one from a running Qubo and no difference). Fuel comes out of the filter connections and the pipe from fuel filter to high pressure pump, clear without bubbles. Nothing comes out of the high pressure pump when turning over with the pump-fuel rail pipe disconnected, even though the pump came from a running, driving car and the pump I removed from the Qubo that won't start will start the Spares Qubo I have. It's very strange

I'll take a look at the wiring by the filter, it's a tight space and I have big hands so definitely could have disturbed something

Cheers

 

[bugsymike]

Hi,

Cheers for response. The electric pump is loud and clear when you turn ignition on (I swapped it anyway for one from a running Qubo and no difference). Fuel comes out of the filter connections and the pipe from fuel filter to high pressure pump, clear without bubbles. Nothing comes out of the high pressure pump when turning over with the pump-fuel rail pipe disconnected, even though the pump came from a running, driving car and the pump I removed from the Qubo that won't start will start the Spares Qubo I have. It's very strange

I'll take a look at the wiring by the filter, it's a tight space and I have big hands so definitely could have disturbed something

Cheers

From what you say it points to electrical. Does your high pressure pump have one or two solenoids on it (one for cut off and one for pressure regulating? The earlier 06 Fiat Grande Punto didn't have any thing on the pump.
Is it possible the fuel cut off solenoid isn't getting a signal to open, whether for a wiring/fuse/immobiliser issue?
Wrong key/spare key?

 

[EathanR]

Havent had a chance to look at the wiring yet, had to sort something else. Doing it now

Yes, that sounds about right though you'll have to excuse me having to ask, this high pressure pump (both the one I took off the non-starter and the one I took off the spares car) have no electrical plugs or anything going into it. There's the fuel inlet, the return and the feed to the fuel rail. What solenoids am I looking for?

I can rebuild a Datsun A series engine with my eyes closed but I have barely had any experience with these modern diesels

 

[varesecrazy]

Did you try the old filter..?

Or a substitute from your running spare

 

[EathanR]

Did you try the old filter..?

Or a substitute from your running spare

I tried fitting the old one back on, no good. Bled the filter both times before trying to start.

Cheers for response though, only thought of that as had a Mk6 Transit that wouldn't start using a NAPA filter but was fine with the second one I bought

 

[bugsymike]

Havent had a chance to look at the wiring yet, had to sort something else. Doing it now

Yes, that sounds about right though you'll have to excuse me having to ask, this high pressure pump (both the one I took off the non-starter and the one I took off the spares car) have no electrical plugs or anything going into it. There's the fuel inlet, the return and the feed to the fuel rail. What solenoids am I looking for?

I can rebuild a Datsun A series engine with my eyes closed but I have barely had any experience with these modern diesels

Like you I am happier with the older vehicles.
However the earlier 1.3 multijets like the Fiat Grande Punto 1.3 and yours by the sound of it didn't have the solenoids on the pump, although I have a 2014 1.3 multijet in a Vauxhall Combo/Fiat Doblo that does have at least one solenoid on the high pressure pump, as in photo.
So any fuel shut off or pressure control may be on the common rail.
If you are certain nothing is dislodged on the electrical side and the immobiliser is doing what it should, then as @varesecrazy suggests try another fuel filter if in doubt.

 

[EathanR]

Thanks for the responses so far. Gave up today and went back to my 1973 Datsun E10 Coupe and did some hours on that. Will try a different fuel filter tomorrow, see if that does anything